Silvercore Podcast 192 Ian Sim

About this episode

Ian Sim spent nearly three decades in the RCMP. In December, alone in his apartment, the strokes came. He saved the wine, booked an Uber to emergency because it was faster than an ambulance, and days later faced a decision about a clot-busting drug with minutes on the clock and nobody to call.

The man who returns to the Silvercore Podcast is in what he calls the afterglow. Colours are brighter. Food tastes better. Any familiar face is an old friend.

Ian cold-called the SAS out of directory assistance and got a yes. He policed Wreck Beach by getting out of the car and learning names. He wrote a counterterrorism paper that got him summoned to the principal's office, and he has rebuilt his off-duty carry proposal into something a province could adopt on its own. And he answers the question an RCMP recruiter asked him at 19: do you have a healthy or an unhealthy interest in firearms?

His answer got the room to go quiet.

Ian speaks as a private citizen. His views are his own, not those of the RCMP.

Chapters

00:00:00 Welcome back

00:01:00 The warning shots

00:12:00 The big one

00:18:00 The clot buster decision

00:29:00 A song and a $5 bill

00:43:00 Is there any such thing as a coincidence?

00:53:00 A Reaper in the desert

00:56:00 Cold-calling the SAS

01:04:00 The afterglow

01:12:00 They don't look like supermen

01:19:00 Radio, Wreck Beach and who works for whom

01:32:00 Smart on crime

01:35:00 Off-shift carry, the proposal rebuilt

01:48:00 Define the problem first

01:55:00 The paper and the principal's office

02:10:00 A Liberal beat him to it

02:14:00 "I wanted to live my life armed"

02:26:00 The next sidearm

02:36:00 Courts and credibility

02:38:00 Until next time

Travis Bader: [00:00:00] Last time my guest sat in this chair, we chatted about firearms and politics and policy and mental health. It went on to become one of the three most listened to episodes of that year. 27 years in the RCMP. It goes without saying, he speaks as a private citizen, not for the force. Last time he came with a proposal, the Last Line of Defense Act.

He had it costed and named, and it was small enough that it can actually work. Welcome back to the Silvercore Podcast, Ian Sim.

Ian Sim: Thank you, sir. Good to be back.

Travis Bader: Why don't you catch us up? 'Cause I, I know the details. I was like, hold on, hold on, hold on. Let's talk about this on air. What's happened between the last time you were here and now?

Ian Sim: I have had [00:01:00] the bumpiest two years of my life. Um But with that has come some new insights, some new thinking, uh, uh, partly out of necessity.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: But it's been an interesting, uh, it's been an interesting two years. Um-

Travis Bader: There's some medical stuff that happened in between there too, wasn't there?

Ian Sim: Yeah.

Travis Bader: Okay, tell me about that one

Ian Sim: because- Okay.

Uh, Christmas, well, last Christmas.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Christmas Eve, I was walking West Van Seawall. Uh, I went to Park Royal, where I used to work for 17 years. I went to Starbucks, no surprise, with my book, but didn't read. It's Christmas Eve. There's a buzz in the air. I- it reminded me of years ago when I used to work there.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: I love watching everyone go by. Hmm. I'm a people [00:02:00] watcher anyways. Um, and just watch the world go by. Christmas Eve, uh, I've got a great bottle of Spanish Rioja at home-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: that I'm gonna open when I get home. I don't know, watch Rudolph or something.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Uh, went home. Uh, before that, no, I went to In- Indigo, one of my happy places.

Went to Five Guys, had a burger. Christmas Eve, traditional Christmas Eve meal.

Travis Bader: Um- Totally, yeah. Five Guys, burgers and fries ...

Ian Sim: got home. Uh, was looking at my phone in the kitchen, and I couldn't really focus on it. So I'm like, "Ah, too much phone."

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Just poured myself a glass of that wine. Hadn't even had a sip.

Went to the living room, turned the TV on, sat down, just about to take a sip of my wine, and I can't really focus on the TV.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And I'm like, "Okay, that's messed up." Um, and then I felt nauseous.

Travis Bader: [00:03:00] Hmm.

Ian Sim: So I put my wine down, $125 Spanish wine. Like, don't spill the wine.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, I don't drink that type of wine every day, but Christmas- It's- I live alone.

Uh, just- Sure ... a bit of a treat. So, and then I got up to go to the washroom 'cause I thought I was gonna be sick. And when I stood up, my mobility was off, but I needed to get to the washroom 'cause I don't wanna throw up on my nice- Mm-hmm ... Persian rug. So I, I kinda crashed into the wall and slid my way along the wall to the washroom, where it all passed.

Passed meaning it, it went away.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: I wasn't sick I felt good. Uh, and I'm

Travis Bader: like- Yeah, but alarm bells have gotta be going off.

Ian Sim: Yeah. So I'm like, "Okay, fuck you, Five Guys, for poisoning me- Right ... on Christmas Eve." Yeah, first

Travis Bader: thing goes to the mind, yeah.

Ian Sim: Um, and I'm like, "But that would do the stomach." Mm. That's the, that's maybe where the nausea's coming from.[00:04:00]

That's not gonna do my vision or my mobility.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: So I'm like, "Okay, I know what happened, but I don't know why." And I'm like, "I think that was a stroke, a TIA." Yeah. A, a small, uh-

Travis Bader: Transient intermittent ischemia.

Ian Sim: There you go. Yeah. I know it's, I call it a commando attack. It's a, it's a s- it's a probing-

Travis Bader: Yeah, let's see-

Ian Sim: commando attack ...

Travis Bader: let's see what we can do. All right. Right? We got it, yeah.

Ian Sim: Where, where is the weakness? Where's the opening? So, uh, I Googled it right away.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And I'm like, "Yep, yep, yep." Dr.

Travis Bader: Google says you're

Ian Sim: dying. Yep, yep. Um, so in a critical incident, um, what you do is clearly important, but the order in which you do it is as important, perhaps more.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: So, you know, 26 years in the RCMP, I been to a few critical incidents, and where you gotta think or react very quickly. Um, so my first instinct was save the wine.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: [00:05:00] So as I was walking back to the living room to grab the wine, I was kinda multitasking. Mm. Um, I hit Uber, 'cause they're faster than any ambulance.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: They were four minutes out. I said yes, picked up the wine, got to the kitchen, got the funnel, poured the wine back, pumped the air out, secured the bottle. Good, the wine's safe. Uber's thinking.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh, I've got three and a half minutes to be downstairs. Mm. 'Cause I, I live alone. Um, I'm clearly not gonna jump in the car now.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: Brushed my teeth, clean underwear, Christmas socks, grabbed my book, I never go anywhere without a book, my pen, my wallet, ID, uh, and my sister and mom's contact info in Halifax, and I was outside in three and a half minutes. Uber pulls in. I said, "Hey, do you know where Lions Gate Hospital is?" "Yes." [00:06:00] "Uh, do you know where the emergency department is?"

"Yes." I said, "Look, dude, I'm having strokes."

If I die or pass out in your car, sorry, but just go. Mm. Right? Get me there, but go. Time is of the essence. Um, and if I do pass out or die in your car, drag me in and tell them I'm having a stroke or drag them out.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Whatever. Try not to bump my head as we go along, but... And he goes, "Nope, we're good. I know where it is."

Uh, and, and U- Uber has changed, uh, transportation, but this guy was brilliant. Yeah. Um, I walked in myself, Lions Gate, uh, told emerge, "I think I'm having a stroke." And of course they get lots of people that come to their window to be admitted and think they're doctors and they know exactly what's happening, and many times they know what's happening 'cause it's happening to them.

Sure. Whether I was having a stroke or not, who knows? Um, but- They

Travis Bader: probably put you [00:07:00] right to the front of the line, didn't they?

Ian Sim: They had me in fairly quickly.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Um, a- I told them I'm a police officer from across the street too, just-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: all the help I can get. Uh, and then they sat- I sat in, in admitting, uh, for...

Well, it was a four-hour wait list.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: One doctor working, Christmas Eve, wait your turn based on triage. So I sat down right beside the nurses station and, um, just sat. I didn't feel like reading-

Travis Bader: Mm ...

Ian Sim: so I knew I wasn't feeling well.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Uh, and there's quite a few people and there's a four-hour wait list. So- My vision starts to go again.

Then I feel nauseous, in the same order as before, and then I throw up all over the place. Mm. Everywhere. So, um, everyone moved back bit of distance.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And if I hadn't had an arm on the right-hand side of my chair, 'cause I was at the end of, of the row of seats, I, I probably would've fallen over.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: I, I was, um, [00:08:00] just hanging by a thread by the, by the armrest.

Two, three, four minutes, I don't know, five, um, it had passed. I felt 100% completely cured. I felt amazing.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: So there's that, "Fuck you, Five Guys." Just cover all the bases, right? Sure. Um, so I get myself up, go to the washroom, uh, clean up, rinse my mouth, all that good stuff. Uh, you know, um, I aimed properly.

Didn't get me, didn't get anyone. They cleaned it up. Sat down again in my chair, 'cause now it's my chair. There's no one around me. They've all moved way back. Um-

Travis Bader: Marking your territory ...

Ian Sim: right. Uh, and I'm like, "Okay." So the nurses are paying attention. Mm. I, I mean, I sat beside the nurses station for a reason.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, location, location, location.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: And I'm like, "Okay, I guess we're gonna find out [00:09:00] if Dr. Sim is right in his prognosis or if it was Five Guys." Uh, I don't know. And, and this is over maybe an hour-

Travis Bader: Sure

Ian Sim: I don't know, another time, uh, half an hour, an hour. I, I'm... It all kind of blended. Uh, vision goes again.

I'm like, "Here we go." Throw up again. Um-

Travis Bader: But this time they give you a tray.

Ian Sim: It's not a tray. It's a cool little plastic bag with handles that's got a little bit of rigidity to it so it, you can kinda hold it from the bottom. Uh, brilliant.

Travis Bader: Oh, okay. Um, you know, I remember as a kid in the hospital, and they give you is- it looked like a little cardboard tray that they would put their utensils on.

Fish

Ian Sim: and chips. Your chip tray.

Travis Bader: Yeah, basically.

Ian Sim: Yeah, yeah.

Travis Bader: Yeah, that they'd put, like, needles and whatever o- on there- Yep ... if they're working on you. Uh, this is what you gotta throw up. I'm looking at this thing. I'm like, "How's this gonna work?" I, I didn't end up throwing up, but-

Ian Sim: Yeah. Well, I, I thought- My

Travis Bader: life's proper

Ian Sim: I'm looking at to the progress- Yeah ... that barf bags have made.

Travis Bader: Yes.

Ian Sim: And I'm like, [00:10:00] "Well done."

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Our, our healthcare dollars are clearly-

Travis Bader: We're catching up

Ian Sim: with things ... partially, yeah. Uh, and then, and so the nurse said, "Look, we'll come and get you here." I, I've moved my way up the list from four hours to pretty well the top of the list.

They're paying attention, as they always are. Um, I go clean up again because it passes. Uh, she's like, "You're next. Uh, doctor's gonna see you." Doctor comes in. He goes, "Look, we're firing you up to, uh, for a CT scan."

Travis Bader: Hmm. "

Ian Sim: We'll talk when you're done." CT scan, come back down. Doctor says, "We're keeping you overnight.

Um, there's something going on here. Neuro, uh, neurology, neurologist- Hmm ... will be in in the morning. We're gonna just tuck you away in a bed off in the corner just behind, I don't know, door number one, door number two, door number three. Just there's a curtain beside it, and we'll check up on you."

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Awesome. Good. So I, I crash back there. It's a bit loud. [00:11:00] Um, as they work through the people, it gets quieter. It's, it's Christmas Eve. Now it's Christmas Day. I didn't sleep. There's a lot on my mind. I don't- Sure ... I'm not feeling well. Um, I don't know, 5:00, 6:00 in the morning, just kinda waking up again, 'cause, you know, you kinda go into your-

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: So now my c- internal clock is waking me up, and I'm like, "Hmm. I kinda feel okay. I can hear everything. Listening. Just my vision hasn't gone. I didn't throw up again. I'm feeling okay."

Travis Bader: Yeah. "

Ian Sim: Well, let's see if I'm okay. Uh, let's test, you know, a level of consciousness, uh-" Sure ... just, you know. Uh, so I take my left hand, and I open and close it as fast as I can.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Perfect. So then I take my right hand, and I open and close it as fast as I can.[00:12:00]

So the big one started

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Uh, the TIAs were, as I described them, little probing commando attacks- Sure ... looking for weakness, chink in the armor, just, um... But now it's, it's, it's, it's D-Day.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Um, you know, I felt like kind of some young German soldier who was a morning person who woke up in Normandy Beach to look out of, of the-

Travis Bader: Everything

Ian Sim: became real

the bunker. We're having y- you know, your coffee. I drink tea, but... And there it is on the horizon.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: It's all there, and it's on. Like, there's no doubt it's on. So-

Travis Bader: So when you were... Just for the people listening.

Ian Sim: Yep.

Travis Bader: So your left hand, no problem. Open, close. Your right hand, slow open, slow close.

Ian Sim: Slow. [00:13:00]

Travis Bader: And is that still like that now?

Or are you able to get- No.

Ian Sim: No Okay I'm, I'm- F- almost fully recovered for all intents and purposes with one side effect

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Um, and we'll discuss that a bit later, but

So again, um, you know, what, what most of this is out of my hands. W- um, you know. So now I need to get the attention of the nurses. But before that, because I could tell, um, that it was the right side of my body, um, being affected-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: you know, y- there's a certain order to things. Like I saved the wine, pushed all my junk to the left so that it wouldn't get paralyzed.

I don't know how this is gonna turn out. Mm-hmm. I have no idea, but let's get it over there. I can hear the nurse just coming at the right exact moment just to check on [00:14:00] me. Mm-hmm. Um, and she's like, "Mr. Sim? Mr. Sim?" And I'm like, "In here."

Whose voice was that? It's affecting my voice. Hmm. I can't talk properly.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Which is weird, 'cause Ian does a lot of talking. He's pretty good at it. So it sounded... Y- you could tell what I was saying. Hmm. Like, she came in and I go, "I think I'm having a stroke." And she knew immediately. She goes, "I know what you were saying, it just didn't sound like you."

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And I realized it didn't sound like me either, but I hadn't thought to talk at that moment. I mean, just when I figured out that my right side is starting to be paralyzed, she came in. The timing was perfect, and, and she just yelled, "He's stroking," and yelled it.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And I, I kinda describe it, it's not true, you know, like ninja doctors re- rappelled out of the ceiling-

instantly. It was, uh, um-

Travis Bader: Yeah, [00:15:00] code blue, they come pretty quick, right?

Ian Sim: Well, blue is, is y- Heart ... you're already dy-

Travis Bader: Is

Ian Sim: it- ... you're dead. But I'm, I'm... So it was a different code.

Travis Bader: I, I thought code blue was, uh, cardiac and there's, there's a heart, something to do with the circulatory system.

Ian Sim: It might be the same code.

She didn't call a code.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: Um-

Travis Bader: My favorite's code brown.

Ian Sim: Yes.

Travis Bader: Which, which

Ian Sim: means- Yeah. We know, we know- ... pretty much

Travis Bader: what it, you'd think it means ...

Ian Sim: we know that in policing. Um, well, the military knows it, too.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Like, for real, 'cause it's actually a thing.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: But, um, and I was... I mean, it was 5:00 in the morning, 6:00 in the morning.

Hmm. Christmas Day. They're at the tail end of their night shift. Like, you know, they're all, everyone's just kinda cruising, as you do towards that time of day on your night shift. The fire was lit. Um, everyone, it was, it was all about Ian Sim.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh, I was up to CT again for another CT scan. Neuro was now in [00:16:00] the hospital.

Uh, after the CT scan, I went down to trauma.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh, where... And I'd bumped into that nurse before, and nurses, cops, whatever, witty banter, uh, is just worth its weight in gold. So she's like, "Oh," you know, like, "You again."

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Whatever. Um, and she's like, "Ian, you know, there's two types of stroking. You're doing the wrong one."

And I just couldn't help but laugh. I just... And I smiled. I just, I, I cracked a smile. And she's like, "There it is, the half smile." Mm-hmm. Because of course-

Travis Bader: You're only one psycho. Yeah, yeah ...

Ian Sim: a- again, brilliant follow-up. I thought, "I'm gonna die laughing." "I am going to actually di-" Yeah, there's worse

Travis Bader: ways to

Ian Sim: go.

Absolutely. I go- This is better than many ways that we see it work- Mm ... or can imagine. It was brilliant. Uh, uh, and, uh, then neuro- [00:17:00] neurologist comes in and he ... First, first words out of his mouth, "Do you have anyone we can call?" Always a good sign, right? I'm like, "No, man. It's, it's just me." And like, "No one?" I'm like, "Nope.

I mean, you know, I got a couple friends, but they don't need to know." Mm. So I realized that no one knows where I am. So I, I ... When I started getting sicker in, um, intake, I fired off a, a, a Facebook message because my sister didn't ... Like, no one knew where I was.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: I, like I said, it was just save the wine, save Ian, out the door, let's go.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: So I got a Facebook message out that I'm having strokes. It's Christmas Eve. I don't know. Stay tuned. Uh, standby. Um, but so he comes down and he goes, "Okay, I don't have anyone to call." Uh, he said, "Well, you have a decision to make. The big stroke started, as you know."

Travis Bader: Mm. "

Ian Sim: And y- [00:18:00] you have a decision to make."

So he said, "There's three levels of intervention, and we have to hurry."

Travis Bader: Mm. "

Ian Sim: There's low, medium, and high." And I'm like, "High."

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: He goes, "Hold on. That can kill you, too." So it's just getting better and better as we go. Mm-hmm. Um, I'm like, "I'd rather talk to her. She's funnier." So he explains it.

Um, informed consent, obviously. There's no one else- Mm-hmm ... that has a say. Low, medium, and high, they're all drugs.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: Um, the high one, 10 to 15% chance it's gonna kill me. Uh, it either blows your head off or it blows the clot up- Sure ... one of two. So we... And he said, "Look, we, we found the problem."

Travis Bader: And they're just, like, what?

Thinners just to allow the blood to go through?

Ian Sim: Yeah.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: Um, clot busters.

Travis Bader: Clot busters. Okay.

Ian Sim: Uh, who you gonna call? Clot busters.

Travis Bader: Gotcha.

Ian Sim: So he said, "We found the clot. Good news is it's very small, [00:19:00] so it's hard to see."

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Uh, he says, "The bad news is it's in the worst possible spot, right on your brain stem."

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: So he goes, "We don't have time." Uh, I said, "Look, just hi, let's go. Get her done." He goes, "You sure?" I go, "Yep." He said, "Okay." Talked to another nurse who came down with him, and she's off to get the drugs, 'cause I'm crashing.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So I sit there and I'm like, "Hmm, is this is how it goes? Is this how I go?" I wanted to go fighting terrorists and pirates and brigands-

saving lives, like, uh-

Travis Bader: Yeah ...

Ian Sim: and have it all videoed so I get a medal when I'm gone or something. Like-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: but that's, that's not how it works.

Travis Bader: No, it's not.

Ian Sim: Um, in my line of work, I meet people on a regular basis who got up, went to work or went to school or went to get on with [00:20:00] their day, and never came home.

Travis Bader: And that was it, yeah.

Ian Sim: And that's how it works.

Travis Bader: That's exactly how it works. If it's a- Like Bob Marley, what did he do? He stubbed his toe and then-

Ian Sim: Yeah ...

Travis Bader: and then that, that was it. Yeah. Cascading events. And maybe there, there was obviously underlying things ahead of that, but...

Ian Sim: So I'm feeling cheated. Fuck you.

Not Five Guys.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: But just fuck you.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Because, you know, I don't even have a nice shirt on. Like, what's... You know.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: So but, but that is just the way. Yeah. Uh, sometimes you... It's expected. It's terminal. It's age. You know what's happening. It's, it's an, an injury or disease. And many times you don't get any say in the matter.

Travis Bader: Well, we all know it's happening, but yet it's not real. It's not on the horizon- No ... for us, and most people never contemplate their own mortality.

Ian Sim: Nope.

Travis Bader: Not in any real way or visceral way which you are, you're thrust into. You're forced into in this one. How'd that change things? [00:21:00]

Ian Sim: Well, I had about two minutes till the nurse came back with my meds.

I don't know. I kinda lost track of time. Mm-hmm. Everything, I don't know if it sped up or slowed down. And I'm sitting there thinking, well, one, um, I'm, I'm feeling cheated by death because fuck you, this isn't my plan.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Ideally, you know, we will have some notice. Friends, family, preparation, everything. Mm.

But, you know, maybe, maybe not. So I thought, "Well, if I die, my sister's gonna kill me." My apartment's a mess. She's not gonna know what to do with the guns. I don't have a will. Like, there's just... And I'm going through the list. Mm. And I'm like, "It's not my problem anymore."

Travis Bader: Yeah, it really isn't, is it?

Ian Sim: So I'm either going to go back, declutter, which I'd already started.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Uh, work on my apartment. I wanna repaint it, blow out some [00:22:00] windows, a few things. Mm. Or I'm gonna go see my dad, who passed away in 2005, and we're gonna catch up over a pint of Guinness.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: He's Scottish, but he liked Guinness.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: I guess I'm okay with either one. And that was it. And that was all in 30 seconds.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, I don't know how long it took until the nurse got back. Uh, she gave this cocktail. I like to say it's radioactive. It was bubbling. Smoke was coming off it. It was neon green.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: It was just clear meds- Mm-hmm ... that, you know, um, they were gonna put into my intravenous and my arm.

And the doctor s- you know, said, "Look, um, you good?" And I go, "Well, not really, 'cause I wouldn't be if I was good." I said, "I know what you mean."

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: I said, "Yeah, I'm good. Let's go." And in it went.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And he stepped back. Trauma nurse kind of stood in the corner.

Travis Bader: Hmm. [00:23:00]

Ian Sim: I just kind of looked at her- Everybody held

Travis Bader: their breath

Ian Sim: and gave a nod and, and, uh, he stood out. Uh, he was, he was just stepped out, um, just off in the corner, and they're just kind of giving me what may have been my last minute or two, three.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: So I kind of, you know, gave the nurse a nod, we're all good, you know, um, and just waited.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And just waited.

Travis Bader: Did you feel the meds as they're going through your body?

Ian Sim: I did, but I don't know if it was physical or-

Travis Bader: Mm ...

Ian Sim: mental.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Um, but there did come a point five or so minutes in that I'm still not dead, and I kind of feel like someone, [00:24:00] like I just drank a Monster drink or something.

Travis Bader: Full of energy?

Ian Sim: Yeah. Did it? I, I felt like I could go for a run.

Travis Bader: Yeah?

Ian Sim: Well, I've never had a Monster, but I've had a-

Travis Bader: Yeah, me neither, actually.

Ian Sim: I had two Red Bulls in Holland years ago.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Separate story. Um, but yeah, I'm like, "I think this is gonna work."

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Because I felt like I could go f- uh, so a few more minutes and I'm, I'm-

I'm critically aware of how I'm feeling. Mm. And I'm, I'm moving my hands. I can't touch my junk, the nurse is there and stuff. But I'm like, "I think this is working." Um, so it worked.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Uh, 50, 10, 15 minutes in, um, and, and they, they didn't leave the room. They just kinda let me- Sure ... have my time, however long was left.

And, and then it's like, "How you feeling?" And I'm like, "I feel amazing." And he goes, "That's a good sign," right? And the nurses. And I'm like, "Ah." [00:25:00] So- Yeah, and then it was just, uh, routine... They let, they let me lie there for a bit longer.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, "Looks like he's gonna live. You know, let's get, um, a room for him. Um, we're clearly keeping him."

Um, so yeah, and, and I'm like, "Okay. Um, merry Christmas

Travis Bader: What about side effects afterwards?

Ian Sim: So there were afterwards, so 24 hour, I wasn't out of the woods yet.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh, good sign, still here, but bedridden for 24 hours because of the side effects of these meds, how strong they are.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: So, uh, they moved me up to the new ward at Lions Gate, uh, the neuro observation unit, the neurology observation unit.

Um, brand new [00:26:00] wing. I had my own bedroom. It was huge. I had a bathroom and a shower in my room. Way ahead of myself because I wasn't allowed to use either of them- Hmm ... for a period of time. So all hooked up, checking every two hours. Um, so there was really no sleep. But I'm here.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Yay. After... And she, you know, the nurse came in and she goes, "You can do anything you want in the bed."

So you're stuck in bed for 24 hours at least.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: First world problems.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Oh, well. Uh, came through the 24 hours. Uh, and, and you know, like every two hours they're checking on you. You're all hooked up, and that's fine. I don't mind. All first world problems. Now I can go to the washroom, um, like a human being.

Uh, I can walk across the [00:27:00] street, street, hall, make my tea. Hmm. I can chat to people a little bit. I, I mean, I'm not... So after I felt like I could go for a run after those drugs all came through, and I like to say, like I said, you could see the, the, the green going out my... None of it. But I, I was... It was low and slow for a while.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But I'm back. So just slowly... I didn't even want, I didn't wanna read. Like it was, I'm still... I felt like I'd been through, um, well-

Travis Bader: Well, emotionally that's gotta take a toll.

Ian Sim: Yeah. I was trying to deal with the physical stuff mostly- Hmm ... but I was exhausted.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: And I, and I was, I was exhausted from both the physical and the emotional.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: But like, like, um, any critical incident, the processing comes after.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: You're just in it. It's on, here we go. Um, and if you get a chance to process it, good. [00:28:00] But that has to be done, uh, over time, well-rested, properly- Hmm ... all that good stuff. So- I got out on the 27th, which is a pretty quick turnaround, December 27th And I was allowed to...

And there was a bunch of testing.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: I had to meet with, um, rehab. I had to meet with neurology. I mean, the whole time.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: So, but I was cleared to walk out of there on my own. We're right across the street from my office.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And I just grabbed my book and my phone and, and, and I walked out. There was, there was one interesting thing that I noticed as I started to feel better, like 26, 27.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Um, I'll listen to music occasionally before I go to bed on YouTube. I don't know how to download. I don't have Spotify or whatever it's called. Sure. Um, I'll find some kid in my building to show me how to do it, but-

Travis Bader: Napster, yeah. [00:29:00]

Ian Sim: So, but I, I, so I... And songs pop up. So two days, one, one, 23rd or the 22nd, uh, this song popped up on my phone.

I don't know. And I'll sometimes click on different songs. I mean, I'll listen to a lot of the same stuff, but click on different songs because it's different. Mm. Let's check it out. So it was a, it was, it was called Oceans Live in Israel.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: No idea.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: There's this picture of this, uh, female singer with a crew cut, dark hair, and just down to a number one.

I'm like, "I don't know. Hit it." It was a sunny day. Like, it looked nice. It was a concert outside. Clicked on it. Um, just soft, nice, peaceful, and I was... You know, it's good before bed.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: I'll listen to the metal in the morning. Uh, and she had a nice voice, but I very quickly realized it's a Christian song.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: It was obviously a Christian song.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: I don't know. No harm, no foul. It's not really my [00:30:00] thing, but- You know, I, I mean, I think most cops have, have a bit of romanticism in them in general.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: As well as probab- In what

Travis Bader: respect?

Ian Sim: Well, policing is, is, is a, is an old conservative, um bureaucracy. Mm-hmm. It's, it's an old industry.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: And, you know, riding in on a white horse- Sure ... with a white helm- or a white hat, saving people's lives. You know, there's a bit of tradition, a little bit of spirituality, a little bit of mythology perhaps. Sure. Just a hint.

Travis Bader: Okay. I can see that, yeah.

Ian Sim: Some, um, a- and like everything, from A to Zed in policing, um, very religious, not religious at all, and somewhere in between.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So me, not so much. I went to church as a kid only because we got pie and ice cream after church.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Like, and we're kids, what do we care?

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: So, but-

Travis Bader: I think that, that was the, uh, as a kid, the same sort of thing. There was in, uh, [00:31:00] White Rock area, Crescent Beach, they had a little church there, and across the street from the church, there was a bakery.

And, uh, every so often the, uh, bakery wouldn't be open on Sunday, and I'd feel totally- Cheated ... gypped that I went in and I didn't get whatever it was afterwards, and I had no time and no patience for it, unless at the end we're gonna get whatever that sweet was from the bakery.

Ian Sim: Right.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: So, and, and church was in North Van.

My dad took us. Um, mom got to stay home 'cause she had us all week.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: We'd get pie and ice cream at Edgemont Diner afterwards from Tony, um, the Asian guy that owned it. Um, and church wasn't a bad place. I mean, I like people. You know, it's, it's kinda interesting. Um, went to a bit of Sunday school. The best part of church was, well, it only happened once, is, uh, it was Protestant church.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: United Church. I'm not sure if it's a... [00:32:00] I don't think it's a priest. Pastor, uh-

Travis Bader: I'm not sure ...

Ian Sim: neither am I. Yeah. But he was talking trust.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: And, um, and he said, "I will give this $5 bill to any of the kids here that comes up, a- and but you have to trust me," right? This, uh, it's based on trust.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: Right? Um, and you have to trust me.

And I'm sitting there, and I'm not,

Travis Bader: I was- I've heard different versions of this, but go on.

Ian Sim: Yeah, so I don't, and I mean, I'm, uh, it was decades ago, so I don't really remember it.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: I just remember there was money involved. Hmm. It was a fiver, and uh, that's the most money I think I'd ever had. So I'm not one to like, I don't wanna be the center of attention.

Hmm. I don't wanna be that person in the room. Um, in policing obviously you often are that person. Sure. And not only are you that person, but you're in charge of things. You have to take control and, and the whole bit. So I mean, that comes.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But it, [00:33:00] uh, when I was 10 or something, not so much.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: And I have to walk down the aisle.

It's the only time I walked down the aisle. Um, I was married, but not in a church.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And I got up there and to get the fiver, and then he holds it out, and then before he gives it to me, he stops me. He turns me around, and I have to face the whole church.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And now he wants to have a nice chat. You know, "Did you trust me?

Did you believe?" All this stuff.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: And I'm, I'm nodding yes, and now I'm, I don't-

Travis Bader: You're like, "It's $5. Of course I did. Come on."

Ian Sim: Right? But, you know, I, I was out of my comfort zone. Yeah, yeah. I, I'm this kid in front of church. Um, at the end of the day, I walked back down the aisle with a fiver in my pocket.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: You know, and, and we didn't talk anything. But Mom finds it in my pocket, 'cause of course I forgot it. Mm. She's doing the wash. She's like, "Whose is this?" It's clearly my shorts. Mm. I'm like, "Oh, the, the, the pastor gave me $5 at church the other day." And Mom's like, [00:34:00] "What?" Like sh- no one told her the story when we got home.

Mm. I didn't. I just changed out of my church clothes and went to play, right?

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: So anyways, so she wasn't sure if she trusted me about that.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: But it all came back. Um, so yeah, this song, Oceans, live in Israel, and it just, it was a soft... I liked her voice. Mm. I liked everything about it. Uh, the words were okay.

Neither here nor there. Um-

Travis Bader: Just a catchy tune.

Ian Sim: Yeah. I- it was just, uh, I don't know. I just, I like... Work often can be chaotic, anarchy, just everything. Sure. So music before bed, I try and listen, you know, Brothers in Arms, like just- Mm ... Dire Straits, just stuff that can chill out, Pink Floyd even. But it was a lovely song.

She had a great voice. The words weren't bad. I kinda liked some of them And then the song was over. And I'm like, [00:35:00] "Okay. There were a lot of things about that song I liked." Uh, it was outside, it was beautiful. She's kinda cool. Um, so let's listen to it again.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: So listen to it again. Because when I get... When something interests me, I want more of it.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: That's a good glass of wine, I'm gonna have another sip. That's a good book, I need more of it.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh, people- That's how we're

Travis Bader: wired, isn't it?

Ian Sim: Yeah. Right? People, um, I need more of you.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Right? Um, so I listened to it a second time, and then I listened to it two more times and I'm like, "When's the last time I listened to four song, uh, brand new-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm

Ian Sim: in a row? Okay, it's bedtime. Just go to go bed." Just kinda something out of character. Hmm. Something a bit different. Forgot all about it. And then when I turn my phone on in the hospital, in the neuro [00:36:00] observation unit, on the 26th I guess, I, by this time I, I just had the energy to turn my phone on. I can sit up a bit, getting a bit bored.

Um, I'm like, "I'm gonna listen to a bit of music." It's been a really shitty Christmas. It's been... And, and I'm exhausted. Like I've been- Sure ... up and down and up and down and I don't know, I did everything right. I'm still here.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: They did everything right. And we'll take, you know, um, you don't know whether it's Mr.

Murphy or Lady Luck on your side sometimes.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Sometimes there's one on each shoulder and you're like- Mm-hmm ... "Really?" So I, I'm just, "Ah, I wanna listen to some music." And I thought I'd listen to my favorite live version of Brothers in Arms by Dire Straits. Hmm. But that song was first on my list, I guess 'cause it was probably the last song I'd listened to before.

Travis Bader: Sure. Makes sense.

Ian Sim: Apparently their algorithms. I

Travis Bader: don't know. Apparently you like this song. And then- We'll give it to you again ...

Ian Sim: and then I'm like, [00:37:00] "I need to listen to that song again." It, it was, it was the perfect song-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: for all the same reasons, but I think a few different ones too. So I listened to that, and I just, I didn't move in my bed, and I was there for a while, and I just, I don't know, I was there for a while.

I'm like, "Let's just turn this off. I'm not gonna do this here." But it, I just found it, I found it interesting that it was, it's not a... You know, if she said, "This is the song I want you to listen to." Mm-hmm. I'd be like, "Yeah, okay. I'll listen to it for you, but I'm probably not gonna like it." And it grabbed me, and then it grabbed me again once I'd come through all that nonsense.

I don't know, just little things that make you go, "Hmm."

Travis Bader: So you feel like you're more receptive at that point and-

Were you reading something into that song? Did you-

Ian Sim: No. I mean, the night I [00:38:00] first heard it- Oh ... on the 22nd or 23rd I just liked it. It, it was outside on a sunny day. It started off nice and slow, like I just liked the instrumental. She started singing. She had a great voice. She's got a great look, you know, uh-

Travis Bader: Yeah

Ian Sim: crew cut, or not crew cut, but shaved her head. Um, it's just warm, inviting, nice atmosphere, everything. And then the words, I'm like, "Oh, this is clearly a Christian song."

Travis Bader: Yeah

Ian Sim: But it's, it's not, it's not a bad Christian song. It's not, it, it's not in your face, rah, rah, rah like a pep rally.

Travis Bader: So-

Ian Sim: It was, it was beautiful ...

Travis Bader: did it awaken in you spirituality?

Ian Sim: That was always there.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: A healthy dose of romanticism, a healthy dose of nostalgia, all of it. [00:39:00] All of it. Hmm. And I'm like, because I, like I said, when did I last listen to a song four times back to back?

So I'm like, "Okay, four times is enough. Let's sleep on it," like many things. Just leave it. And, but I, I just felt going to bed that night was awesome, right? Hmm. I mean, I sleep well anyway, so. But yeah. And then when it popped up first on my phone, algorithms, other people have different, uh, ideas as why that was, but I'm like

I need to hear this again

Travis Bader: I feel like you're dancing around- I forgot

Ian Sim: about it

Travis Bader: Feel like you're dancing around something because you've-

Ian Sim: Well, no, I mean, I'm, I mean, I'm pretty much an open book. I just And probably because I was... The last, um, the last year and a half at work had been dark.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Rough. I'd already been doing a lot of thinking about [00:40:00] everything.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Mostly about getting, um, just getting healthy. And that comes I don't know. I mean, you know, some people say to get healthy, you know, the North American version, a burger and a beer. Okay, well that works once a week. Sure. But I'm not sure it's gonna work every day.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: You know, and then for trauma and, and mental health challenges, you know, the old standby hookers and blow.

Well, that's off the table- Mm-hmm ... clearly. Um, so I've, I was just working on-

Travis Bader: Or grin and bear it, right?

Ian Sim: Yeah. Toughen up. Old, old school, yeah. Suck it up, princess. That's

Travis Bader: right.

Ian Sim: Um, so no. I stepped away from work, um, as a peer-to-peer counselor for the RCMP S- which is a program that people at every office and multiple people at a larger office, detachment, precinct, whatever you wanna call it, [00:41:00] we don't call them precincts, but all the Canadian public that watch American cop shows might

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh-

Travis Bader: Yeah, it's just a misdemeanor, right? Everyone knows what that, that means

Ian Sim: My Miranda rights.

Travis Bader: That's right.

Ian Sim: Can you call your lieutenant?

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, just, yeah, it just goes on and on. But So yeah, I, I recognized when I was starting to have some challenges at work.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: I realized something was off Music comes into this as well.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Well, let's... I guess we'll start there. Um-

Travis Bader: Well, hold on. I... Before I forget-

Ian Sim: Yes.

Travis Bader: Okay. Uh, it's interesting. Well, there's two things. One thing at the back of the head, which is completely ancillary to this whole thing, but you probably, speaking of strokes, you probably heard about those three women on the park bench, and the flasher came and flashed them.

And the witnesses saw the first one right away had a stroke. Second woman beside her had a stroke, and witness said the [00:42:00] third woman probably would've had a stroke, but she couldn't reach. Anyways, that, that, that was one, one thing, but I got a, a message here. Let's see what it is. Comes through Signal. Just out of curiosity...

No, it's different. Um, Seb, good friend of mine. Yep. You know Seb Lavoie?

Ian Sim: Yep.

Travis Bader: When he had his, uh, leg amputated, and they were unable to... Well, they're supposed to put a nerve blocker in for the pain, but they didn't. They didn't have it in the right place. He was in, like, turn up to 11 pain on the, on the dial, and he said the song that he listened to over and over and over again, it turned out to also similar thing, it was a Christian one, but, uh, uh, was Rescue by, uh, Lauren, looks like Daigle,

Ian Sim: Dieigle?

Look up- Daigle or Dague?

Travis Bader: D- Yeah ... D-A-I-

Ian Sim: I know it. I sent a song from her that she did to a girlfriend in Tasmania yesterday.

Travis Bader: [00:43:00] What's interesting is he sent me that one this morning, and he said, "This is what got me through, and I listened over and over and over again."

Ian Sim: And, you know, are there any... Is there any such thing as a coincidence, right?

I mean, I don't read too much into some things. There's, there's often, um, there's often a trail of blood, popcorn, breadcrumbs. Or there's also a trail that's not obvious. You can't see it. What I've realized after my big adventure at Christmas is I need to get some stuff done. So it was all on my to-do list.

Travis Bader: So what do you need to get done?

Ian Sim: I need to tell you when I met Kyle Lamb

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, went to Vegas a number of years ago, the only time I went to Vegas, for the Safari Club International-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: Convention. Apparently people go to drink and sit by the pool, just not me. Um, but I went to Safari Club Convention, and I thought, "Well, I'll kill a couple birds with one stone.

[00:44:00] After the convention, I will go and drive down to, uh, southern Arizona." Is Arizona border, Mexican border? Yeah. Yeah. So, um, I had a good friend down there in Sierra Vista, so it's right-

Travis Bader: Mexico, New Mexico? Yeah, no, the- Yeah ... border. Yeah.

Ian Sim: So Sierra Vista-

Travis Bader: Of course ...

Ian Sim: w- he can see Mexico from his- Mm-hmm ... backyard. Um-

Travis Bader: That's great

Ian Sim: so David, uh, is ex-Special Forces, Rhodesian- Mm ... South African, so I said, "I'll meet him, too." In Vegas, I was in the lineup at Mandalay Bay. We're just checking in. Sure. And I don't know, there's a husband and wife in front of me, and he turns around, and I'm like-

Travis Bader: It's Kyle and Melinda ... "

Ian Sim: Mr. Lamb." I don't... He doesn't know me from Adam.

I, I've just seen his stuff.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, and he's like, "Yeah." And I said, you know, we, we started chatting. We're stuck in a big lineup. Mm-hmm. Start chatting, I introduce myself, um- Uh, what are you [00:45:00] doing? This and that, blah, blah, blah. I've seen some of your work. Um, and, uh, and then we start talking 'cause the line-up's slow and it's- Mm

we're just so... And she said, "Oh, I've been up to Vancouver with my son, skied Whistler." Um, yeah. What do you do up there? Oh, I'm, you know, RCMP. And of course, most Delta guys are pretty in- um, impressed when you say you're RCMP. I mean, they got pictures of us up in their barracks and, you know, all

Travis Bader: that kind of stuff.

So I was like, I, I hope he's, hope... Yeah, fair enough.

Ian Sim: So, and then, a- and then we started chatting about, um, I was talking to some of the- ... uh, do you know one of the Millbrook guys? Uh, this guy, he's just like, "Oh, is he that little guy, Funny?" I go, yeah, yeah. Mm. And, and, and we just start going off- Yeah ... and, and having a chat.

Um, and that was it. You know, pleasure, um, enjoy your time. Mm. You know, he asked what I'm doing and stuff. So, you know, and then you mention his name, and that's the only time I met him.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: But I follow his work and then, like I said, uh, I'd like to see where Seb lives. I, I just wanna see more [00:46:00] of everything.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, l- like Lauren Day comes up out of the blue through Seb. And then Kyle, you mentioned Kyle and-

Travis Bader: Yeah, I don't know if these things are all out of the blue though. I mean- But they're,

Ian Sim: it's a small world we live in.

Travis Bader: It, it is, but it's also where we put our attention, and I think, you know, what did Shakespeare say?

It's neither good nor bad, but thinking makes it so, right? And oftentimes I look at things and in hindsight, you look back and you say, "Everything was there. All the evidence was there." And maybe it was, right? Maybe it was and you're blind to it, or maybe our brains are really good about after the fact being able to put all this stuff together, and I mean, in the expert witness area- Mm

you realize that quite often we are our own worst witnesses, right? In, in, um, 'cause your brain's got the ability to convince you of things that might not actually have been the reality for somebody else, right?

Ian Sim: And memory is, uh, is as we now know, is, is imperfect.

Travis Bader: [00:47:00] Right.

Ian Sim: Um-

Travis Bader: But in all of that, like when I look and I say, well, doesn't matter, right?

When you're at the end point and you look at it and you say, "Oh, it's 'cause of all of this," like it really doesn't matter how you got there or what you're looking at. Really what matters is how you feel about it now and what you're gonna do with it. Yep. And if you can point it back to anything that you want to, and it's for a positive thing in your life and, and those around you, fantastic.

But I, I'm, I'm not yet convinced of all of these little things that are lining up as being, um- Uh-

Ian Sim: Chance ...

Travis Bader: chance, weird coincidences. Yeah. But I, but I do think that we put our attention to certain things, which... And I- it was funny 'cause I brought it up with Kyle, and I don't think if my... I don't think my explanation was, uh, uh, 100% on there, or maybe it was just stupid and he was being kind and not, uh, calling it out.

But I said it's like, uh, it's like Jeep drivers, [00:48:00] 'cause he was talking about a friend of his and how he can see all of these things happening, saying, "You know, my son just got a Jeep." And all of a sudden he says, "You know, there's Jeeps everywhere." Well, the Jeeps were always there. You- you're just open to seeing them now.

Ian Sim: The minute I bought a Mazda, they were everywhere.

Travis Bader: Right. Of course, right?

Ian Sim: Yep. Well, and we're a product of our environment.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, we get the parents we get. Um, w- we have control over what we have control over.

Travis Bader: Which is?

Ian Sim: Uh, well, I'd say, uh, like your three-foot world. Like, initially, you know, I've got... We live in our three-foot world-

Travis Bader: Hmm

Ian Sim: and then it goes out from there. So, but we, we don't... We have control over how we react to all those things that- That's it ... we have no control over.

Travis Bader: I think that's the only control. The only- Yeah ... according to Viktor Frankl, right? The only control you really have is how you choose to respond to what's done to you.

Ian Sim: Yes. So as we know, bad things happen.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Bad [00:49:00] things happen every day in Canada-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: to good people. Uh, and by bad things, I mean terrible, horrific things-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: in our big cities, in our small towns, and everywhere in between, in the middle of nowhere.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: It's just, they're like the lottery in a bad way.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, someone wins the lottery every week in Canada But, uh, it's not me, it's not you

Travis Bader: Mm. Well-

Ian Sim: We win the, we didn't, we win different lotteries

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: So, so bad things happen all the time, but I mean, no one thinks crime's gonna happen to them-

Travis Bader: Mm ...

Ian Sim: until it does. Or bad things are going to happen, and it happens all the time.

Mm. Most of which you never see in the media. You know, I said we're, we're, we're what, um, we're but, uh, you know, seconds away from catastrophe.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Because it's happening somewhere right now in, in this country, maybe even in this city. It's just that certain things don't, a lot of it doesn't make the news.[00:50:00]

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But we see it, of course, in our industry. So yeah, we can control, we control how we choose to react, and if you have coping strategies through training, wisdom, experience, age, dumb luck, mentorship, leadership- Mm ... a guide You can navigate all those things that you on your own might not be able to navigate.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So y- And everyone you meet, it, everyone's a stranger until they're not

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm

We'll just move the mic a little closer

Ian Sim: Little closer?

Travis Bader: There you go.

Ian Sim: Um, that friend I was going down to Arizona to visit after the Safari Club, um, convention.

Travis Bader: Hmm. [00:51:00]

Ian Sim: Uh, I met... Well, here, and I guess is this another coincidence? I meet, uh, Craig Bone, the artist-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: at the Safari Club convention. I was familiar with Craig's work, uh, painting, wildlife paintings primarily, but also Christian paintings.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, and he's known primarily for his wildlife work. Uh, he was in the Rhodesian Light Infantry until a mortar round in Mozambique, uh, connected with his leg and, you know, that was it. But he- Mm-hmm. So and then I just, I just bumped into him 'cause I like his artwork.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And he does a little bit of, uh, military art.

He's done, I think, a whole book for the Marine Corps and done some paintings for the Marine Corps as, as a way to, to give back to his wider community-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: veterans, oh, and serving, uh, soldiers. So, um, he's like, "Oh, where are you from?" "Canada." "Why are you here?" "Check out the convention. Um, getting into hunting, [00:52:00] interested in Africa, just all of it."

Uh, and then I'm going down to visit a buddy in, in Arizona there. And, uh, so he's like, "Well, you know, how'd you, how'd you meet them?" Like, I said, "Well, it's, it's David Scott Dolan." And he goes, "I know David." Right? R- from Rhodesia.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So they, they know each other. It's a small world. Um, and now we're chatting and, "Oh, let's get a picture and show David."

And, and again, you know, I meet Kyle Lam in the lineup. Um, and we've got, uh, you know, a person or two in common. Um, I meet Craig Bone there just, I don't know, by accident, I would say, but I don't know. Are there really accidents? Uh, and then I drive down after the convention, um, through the desert by myself, beautiful, and, uh, to see my buddy David.

And on the way down, um, there's a lot of desert driving from Vegas down to Sierra Vista.

Travis Bader: Hmm. [00:53:00]

Ian Sim: And y- you just kind of zoned out a little bit driving through the desert, b- the big blue, blue sky, the desert, and I see something off to my right moving. Movement gets our attention-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: quickest. And I think, "Oh, it's a bird."

Well, no, it's a huge bird. So I look over, and there's no traffic. I'm in the middle of the desert. There's just nothing. And it's... I think it's a Reaper drone.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: It's huge. It's a monster. It's the size of a jet fighter. Like, it's-

Travis Bader: It's coming to, to check you out.

Ian Sim: And, and I guess they train down there.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: There, there's a military base, Fort Huachuca maybe- Hmm ... um, and, and another... And, uh, and this huge flying pterodactyl- ... flies gently from my right all the way across, and it, it's not making any noise.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, th- they're quiet. They're not jet. I think they're propeller. So... [00:54:00] And this magnificent prehistoric futuristic pterodactyl flies in front of me, and I'm like, "I think I had a religious experience."

It was just bizarre. It was- From the drone ... so wild. Yeah. In the desert by myself, couple hours into the drive. I'm almost down in, uh, Sierra Vista, and I don't know. It, it was just those little things that stick with you.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: So I get down to David and I tell him, and he goes, "Oh, yeah, they're... They train here.

They train there." Um, I'd met David in the '80s. Um, I was interested in... Well, I've been interested in terrorism, special forces, counterinsurgency warfare ever since... I don't know, weird kid. But-

Travis Bader: Like all kids, right?

Ian Sim: Well, I grew up in, in elementary school with, with World War II books. Sure. Time Life, I think- Yeah

in, in the library.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Every Saturday and Sunday, it was World War II or Korea War movies.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm. [00:55:00]

Ian Sim: Guns, planes. Cool.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Um-

Travis Bader: Yeah, I don't think you're alone in that one.

Ian Sim: Yeah, no. So I w- um- I wanted to do VI- the Cold War was still on.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh, I was following terrorism by now, went from warfare to terrorism.

Europe was a hotbed of terrorism in the '70s and the '

Travis Bader: 80s. You know-

Ian Sim: Baader-Meinhof and- And, and stealing their Baader-Meinhof wagons. Yeah. The BMW stands for Baader-Meinhof wagon.

Travis Bader: Ah. Yeah.

Ian Sim: Um, yeah, Red Brigades in Italy, ETA in, in, uh, Spain.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Direct Action in France, IRA, right? Mm-hmm. Um, dad being from Scottish, m- my, my center of my military world was kind of British.

Mm-hmm. SAS, colonialism, India, Africa.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So if I wanted... I thought if I'm gonna get into VIP security, close protection, personal security detail, whatever [00:56:00] it's called now, close protection I think. Mm-hmm. Um, so I contacted, 'cause I knew the Brit- British SAS would, was doing stuff like that So I, I just phoned the British SAS up.

There was no computers and internet stuff. I, I, I knew that they operated out of, uh, Duke York Barracks. They had a presence in London I just looked up directory assistance and did some homework and phoned to Duke York's barracks and

Travis Bader: It's amazing how much you can get just by putting in that little bit of legwork,

Ian Sim: hey?

And I asked for, um, so someone from, uh, Survival Wing, Mountain Arctur- Mar- Mountain and Arctic Warfare Survival Wing or something, whatever the, the SAS called that unit.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And, "Hello." Got some English guy chatting with me on the phone. Told him I'm interested in, um, survival school training courses, and my guess is, is the best courses are [00:57:00] probably either current or ex-members from, of you guys.

And he's like, "Yep." And then, um Also, uh, like VIP security bodyguard. 'Cause the, they, they were big and heavy into that because during the terrorism campaigns in, in Europe-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: um, executive protection bodyguarding was huge.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: So he's just chatting. "What's your name? Where you calling from?" "Oh, my name's Ian Sim."

He goes, "That's a good Scottish name." And I could tell he was English.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And I said, "Have you got a lot of Scotsmen in the regiment?" And he goes, "What? Poisoned dwarfs?" Short little wee guys that can carry a house up and back down the hill- Mm ... for a week straight like this. And we just chatted away, and he said, "Oh, here, here's a, here's a, here's a couple of names."

He, he's not gonna tell me. Like, he just- Sure ... actually know, but he, he can tell I'm younger and- Yep ... we're chatting away. Um, you know, here, here's a company you might wanna try this and that. So I go to, uh, an executive protection against terrorism course in the States. It's a British company.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: So they come [00:58:00] over and, uh, Dennis Martin, um, who's well, was well known in the British close protection community as well as the martial arts community, it's kind of his company, CQB Services.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: Uh, he had, uh, one of his, uh, head instructors was a tall guy named John Lofty Wiseman.

Travis Bader: Yep.

Ian Sim: Um-

Travis Bader: Everyone knows that name ...

Ian Sim: they do now. This is before, before he wrote his book- Mm ... or maybe when it just came out. Um- Mm-hmm ... David Scott Donlin, ex-Rhodesian Special Forces, South African Special Forces. Um- A couple of American kind of gun writers.

One was a cop, um, who wrote in the gun magazines. Um, uh, Leroy Thompson was another one-

Travis Bader: Mm ...

Ian Sim: who wrote guns, knives, special forces, but he worked in close protection for years. So he wrote in Soldier of Fortune, SWAT Magazine- Oh, I remember ... like all, all the way back.

Travis Bader: Is that magazine still around?

Ian Sim: No.

Travis Bader: I [00:59:00] remember going to the gun shows as a kid and picking up the Soldier of Fortune magazines, like, "These are amazing."

Ian Sim: Yeah, your eyes popped out of your head. Right. Same thing. Um, um, uh, so, and, and a couple other, a, a US Secret Service deputy special agent in charge for George Bush Senior, like a- Mm. So I went to the States, took this course. Um, my eyes kind of popped out of my head, 'cause I'm like, "This is awesome. These guys are, like, off the charts."

Um, went down a s- the next year and took the same course over to get prepped up. 'Cause I was thinking, well... And I was also taking Russian lessons at the same time. Cold War is still on.

Travis Bader: As one does, yes.

Ian Sim: I wanna be a spy, intelligence work. Russian would obviously help.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Um, started taking lessons, like, again, weird kid.

But yeah, so that's where I met David Scott-Donald, and we clicked. Mm. And, and Lofty and Dennis, the Brits, and, and just, they were all good guys. Um, so David and I kept in touch afterwards. [01:00:00] Uh, David had moved after the Rhodesia... So David was, David Scott-Donald was in the RLI, then Tracker Combat Unit, which kind of morphed into the Selous Scouts.

Mm. But he, then he went C Squadron, Rhodesian SAS.

Travis Bader: Mm. I

Ian Sim: guess he had a bit of a falling out with the CO, so CO probably won't leave, but so he left and, and he went to Selous Scouts, where he was the training officer, set up all the training, selection, the whole bit. Interesting stories. Uh, and then he went south to the Recce's, uh, afterwards.

And then after the war, he moved to the States, and he taught combat tracking all over the world for decades.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: So I was going, I, I hadn't seen David, uh, CTB Services, that British firm, and all the guys, uh, went to Fort Lewis, um, a, a year after that, maybe two. So I popped down to visit the gang, um, on their after class.

Um, David [01:01:00] and I always stayed in touch. John Wiseman and I, Lofty, Lusty Wiseman- ... um, also s- kept in touch. Um, I went to Hereford a year or two after that. And I'd been to Gunsite after, I guess, a couple times.

Travis Bader: So did you do much CP work after doing-

Ian Sim: None. I was working in the grocery store, Supervalu Park Royal in West Vancouver.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: But as a young guy, I mean, my parents and my sister moved to New Brunswick when I was in grade 12, so I was on, out on my own- Just reading. Sure. Um, um-

Travis Bader: Figuring it all out. And,

Ian Sim: and, and, and trying to get trained up.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Uh, and, and, uh, by luck or partly because of my research is, is nailing these kind of high-profile awesome instructors.

Travis Bader: So what did you learn from those instructors and from those days that would be applicable to people now? 'Cause I see you've got a couple of books here. [01:02:00] We've got Ending Violent Crime, it looks like, in the First 30 Seconds. Seems like, um, uh, your background and your research and the work you've done would be, uh, cumulating to something that would be, um, effective for, for people today.

Ian Sim: I think I have some marketable skill sets. Um- Well, I, I know I do. Um, I was at a use of force conference at the Justice Institute not that long ago and- Mm-hmm ... you got recruiting tables there from Surrey Police Service and, and other places. Uh, and you're networking with, it's not all cops at the use- Yeah

of force conference. So, you know, what do you do? Um, who are you? Uh, and well, you know what? I'll be retired in a couple years. I'll be a free agent-

Travis Bader: Mm ...

Ian Sim: in the not too distant future. And everyone's passing you your card, right?

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, you know, come over to SPS, do this, do [01:03:00] that. So I'm just in the information gathering phase.

I'm kind of drinking through a fire hose right now. I know what's out there.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: But, but there's, I don't know what I don't know.

Travis Bader: Who put on that conference this year?

Ian Sim: It was, uh, well, it wasn't this year because of FIFA.

Travis Bader: Right, right,

Ian Sim: okay. So the JI, the Justice Institute of British Columbia canceled it because of FIFA.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And they'll pick it up again next year. So the JI, the Justice Institute of BC, the JIBC sponsors it.

Travis Bader: But it wasn't put on by them. They sponsor it.

Ian Sim: They sponsor it. Uh, no, I think they put it on.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: And- '

Travis Bader: Cause I- ...

Ian Sim: it's run through the JI.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: I'm pretty sure.

Travis Bader: I remember, uh, doing some through the TTC, uh, going back a few years.

Actually right before COVID, the last class that was run before they- Sure ... everything was shut down for COVID at the TTC was a use of force conference. Yep. And, uh, I think Chris Butler was one of the ones that helped and organized it. He's been on the podcast as well.

Ian Sim: Okay. So I'm looking forward [01:04:00] to...

Someone said I should present at the next one.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Uh, why not? Uh, right now at this stage of the game, you know, for much of your life, well, maybe, maybe not. I don't know. I'm not sure. I've got way more time in the rear view than I've got out the front windscreen.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: So- Since my strokes, colors are brighter, food tastes better.

Any familiar face is like an old friend. Like, I'm just... I feel, uh, I call it I'm in the afterglow.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: I'm not sure how long it's gonna last. I'm still in it, and it might last hopefully till the end.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: But you can't see it n- right now, but I'm oozing gratitude and thanks. There's a big puddle of it-

Travis Bader: Well, there's a very

Ian Sim: big-

underneath me ...

Travis Bader: difference in you here than you the last time you sat in that chair here, and you can see it.

Ian Sim: Uh, and I can feel it.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Uh, [01:05:00] I got some catching up to do.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: But I am restricted by the same thing we all are, which is time.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: But w- we probably, we, we know people who get a lot done and live two or three lives in the, the time that some people live one or not even.

Travis Bader: Yep.

Ian Sim: So when I met, um, you know, Lofty a- and, and Dennis and, and David s- uh, Scott Donelan, and, and you know, I, I, I knew where they came from.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: I knew what they've done within reason. Um, like when I w- so I went to Hereford, and John lives in Hereford. The SAS are based in Hereford.

Travis Bader: And my- What color's the boathouse?

Ian Sim: Pardon me?

Travis Bader: What color's the boathouse?

Ian Sim: I don't know. It was... So, and I don't know if it was- It's a

Travis Bader: reference to the movie Ronin.

Ian Sim: Okay.

Travis Bader: Fair enough.

Ian Sim: Um, The Green Man Pub's probably still there.

Travis Bader: [01:06:00] Mm.

Ian Sim: Yeah, so I'm in Hereford and John's there, lives there, wife, and I think he's got seven kids. Uh, my dad's there too. M- my dad was visiting friends there, so again, let's kill a few birds with one stone.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Uh, so yeah, John takes me, um, takes me out. We have a pint and, and chat. Uh, shows me around a little bit.

Takes me to a buddy's house, uh, ex-regiment, who wrote a book called, uh- I can't remember the title. One's Man- One Man's SAS? His name is Lofty Large.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: Lofty Large. So that alone will bring up the book.

Travis Bader: One Man, One- One Man's Army S- Is that it?

Ian Sim: Maybe.

Travis Bader: One, One... Or No Man Left Behind? I think there was

Ian Sim: that one.

I don't think that one. But Lofty Large.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: Uh, I'm with Chatton, and Lofty's got some books on his... And he's got this one book. It's a, I don't know, like a 12 [01:07:00] by 12, eight by 14, whatever, uh thin book. It's all, it's all photos-

Travis Bader: Mm ...

Ian Sim: of the war in Oman. So it's the regiment, the SAS regiment in Oman. And it's, uh, it doesn't have a dust cover.

It, the cover is the color photo.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And the photos inside are brilliant.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And it was one of the SAS officers that took all the photos on his old Leica camera.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And, and, and th- they're spectacular, right? Sure. He's got a Leica camera, desert light. Um, his subject matter are, are brilliant.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And I'm like, "Oh."

And I'm just a book freak.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: So I can get Lofty's book, and I did. I ordered it. But yeah, this is kind of, it was a private release. There's not many of them around, this and that, rah, rah, rah. So I, I track one down years later in, in Hong Kong and grabbed it, and I still have it today. And there's a picture of John Wiseman, Lofty Wiseman in, in the book.

And of course, you've read the stories about [01:08:00] the Battle of Mirbat and, and, um, the regiment's presence in Oman. And then of course you hear a couple stories from John. Um, and then the book's brilliant. I still have it to this day.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: So that was, that was fun. Great, you know, kind of playing tour guide. Um, we're driving, we're driving back.

He's gonna drop me off, and he's like, "Oh, you wanna come by the camp?" Like-

Travis Bader: Of course, yeah ...

Ian Sim: duh.

Travis Bader: Yeah, sign me up. Let's

Ian Sim: go. Um, I, you know, I was like in, inside I was freaking out. "You wanna come by the camp?" Like, "The British SAS camp?" Yeah. Like, I was just-

Travis Bader: Mm ... I'm

Ian Sim: like, "Oh, yeah, sure. That'd be awesome." He says, "Well, let's, let's, uh, we'll swing by the camp tomorrow."

So I thought I'd died and gone to heaven. Yeah. I mean, I thought I'd died and gone to heaven being trained by these guys a couple years earlier. Um, as it turns out, the next day we don't get to go to the camp because his sister's sick. Mm. She ends up in the hospital or something, so he passes me off to one of his, uh, [01:09:00] ex-regiment guys.

"You wanna go hike Brecon Beacons where we do selection?" Yeah. "Yeah, man. Let's go."

Travis Bader: Yeah. We'll do

Ian Sim: the sand dance. Okay. So away we go. Uh, it was just me, him, and the dog.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And we just chat, talking. So, but I, you know, we make, we make our own luck in this world, uh, uh, to a great extent. Um, you know, I, I researched these courses, picked these courses, went and trained with them.

Now you've got connections with these people, and I went to connect with them when they were in Fort Lewis. And my dad's in Hereford. Why don't I pop over and, and- Yeah ... see Dad and John? Um...

Travis Bader: Yeah, we do make our own luck. It's a, um It's, it's funny how your world changes the second you stop just accepting everything that happens to you and start thinking about what can happen for you and how can you affect what happens for you.

Even, I [01:10:00] m- I remember, I think it was grade 10, Simple Things, the author of Shoeless Joe, uh, the book that, uh, Field of Dreams was based on, W. P. Kinsella. In typical ADHD fashion, I leave that book report till, I don't know, the night before. What do I do? I find out where the guy lives. I heard he was somewhere in Canada.

Turns out he had a phone number up in Hope that would then transfer down to a property he has in White Rock, which had a f- an answering machine that left- Wow ... a forwarding number in, I think it was Florida or California. He was on the beach and he ends up taking the call from me, and I do my, my whole book report there.

Because you take those extra steps to follow through, and makes for a fun story. I got an A on the book report, which I left to the last moment, and the teacher gave me a copy of the book because he was so impressed after he finished giving a whole bunch of, uh, baseball anecdotes. "You're not trying to fly one over in left field, are you?"

And I'm like, "What are you even talking about? I don't..." I wasn't even following the book, let alone... [01:11:00] And But w- in the same way, like you call up over to the UK, you get put in with the right people. Is that luck or did you make it happen? And I would, I would say 100%. We, we author our own destiny.

Ian Sim: Yeah.

Travis Bader: And what we wanna do with that afterwards, 'cause it's one thing to talk to WP Kinsella and get the book report and...

But once that connection is open, you've got that opportunity to, to further explore where that could take you and what you can do with that for others, because I find that the offers will dry up pretty quick if it's a one-way road, if it's always one person always going out looking for what they can get from, let's say it's Lofty.

"Hey, what can I get? W- what you, what can you teach me here?" There, there's gotta be some reciprocity- Mm-hmm ... in some way of value that you bring back, and that's your responsibility after you make those connections.

Ian Sim: Well, I don't think I brought anything or taught, uh, Lofty anything. However-

Travis Bader: But the value doesn't have to be you teaching him.

It could be you taking what he's taught you and helping others.

Ian Sim: So he knew that [01:12:00] here's a kid, um, you know, young man, uh, who, who clearly has a, a serious and mature interest in the regiment that I just spent 26 years with, having got in at the youngest age of anyone at 19- Mm ... and leaving as the regimental sergeant major.

And he's... And you know, we were out, uh, I don't know, coming back to the car and stopped and met one of, uh, one of the officers from the regiment. And we're having a chat and, you know, he introduces me and this, that. And, and I was like, "None of these guys look like supermen or heroes. They look... They're not big, jacked, tattooed They're not.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: And, and-

Travis Bader: A lot of them actually are quite small. And-

Ian Sim: Yes ...

Travis Bader: and I, you know what I, uh, I liken it to, it's like going up the Coquihalla. You got a great big semi-truck going up the Coquihalla. Yeah, you can probably carry a lot of weight. You're gonna [01:13:00] burn a lot of fuel. You're gonna go slow. But you got a small kinda sports car going up there that's a bit more surgical.

It's gonna burn way less gas, it's gonna get up there faster, and it's, uh, way less damage and wear and tear on the, the vehicle, so it can do that trip again. And that's what these special forces guys are like. They're quite often shorter, um, higher muscle to body mass ratio as opposed to the muscle you'd need if you're a big 6'6" guy like myself.

Ian Sim: Poisoned dwarfs.

Travis Bader: There you go. And, uh, it's a mindset or a mentality which is, uh, I, I remember when I was first introduced to it was, uh, just hiking up Mount Beautiful here, and my boots were just full of blood from the blisters that had been torn open. But I can't say nothing. I can't say nothing with the people I'm with.

I gotta be tough. And then another guy's like, "Oh, you know, I'm kinda getting cold." And they're like, "Well, stop and administrate yourself." I'm like, hold on a second. Like, I wasn't gonna be that guy talking about any discomfort. But that [01:14:00] mindset of not just grin and bear it and tough it out, it's, "No, well, we'll just have a cup of tea and we'll just get something warm on, and then we'll get up and we'll keep going.

Because we're gonna do it again tomorrow, and the next day, and the next day." Whereas the person who just wanted to tough it out, they're done at the end of that, that one day. So different mindset, different, different way of approaching the problem. Totally not what Hollywood would have you think.

Ian Sim: No, and some, some look the part.

That's fine. Um, you know, guys in the regiment in the, in the '70s and the '80s, there's differences now. Hmm. Uh, and that's just fine. Co- uh, society changes. Your, your, your, um, your raw material's gonna, might look and talk a bit different, whatever. Um, selection hasn't changed. You know, um, but th- that was... It was what came out of their mouths which was the value, not, not some sort of hero syndrome that, "Oh, you were in the SAS."[01:15:00]

Uh, it was- I love witty banter I like joking around, but I like being serious about the stuff that we should be serious about

Travis Bader: When it's time to be serious

Ian Sim: And that's not most of the time

Travis Bader: That's right

Ian Sim: It, it just isn't. So-

Travis Bader: Robin Horsfall, he was at the, uh, Iranian embassy siege Yep He's been on the podcast, and he gave a perfect example about that, and they had other units from...

I think he was saying the, the Americans were there, and they're looking at these crazy British people, and they're just joking around and goofing around, and like, "You're supposed to take it serious. You're supposed to be gung ho, hoo-rah." And, well, when it's time to be gung ho, hoo-rah-

Ian Sim: Yeah, yeah ...

Travis Bader: the switch flips- Yep

and away they go. But you can't, you can't maintain that level the entire time.

Ian Sim: Well, and Lofty was saying, uh, we were talking about Delta Force, 'cause, you know, Charlie Beckwith, and he goes, "Oh, old Charlie," um, who founded Delta Force. So yeah, we went down to, uh, [01:16:00] Fort Bragg to, to the compound, uh, and checked it out, and he goes, you know, "Their armorer's room just stretched out."

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: The benches for the armorer's room, and bright lights, and just all the fancy tech- Yeah ... and everything. He goes, "Our armorer's bench in Hereford's like 12 feet. It's just two six-foot tables stacked together."

I mean, he told me he was in Malaya, uh, Borneo fighting there, and he was, uh, on point, lead scout, and he said all of a sudden this big orange man, we just crossed paths. Very close.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Dense triple canopy jungle, and it, it's an orangutan.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And he's standing there looking at this orangutan, and the orangutan's staring, looking at him.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And Lochie's like, "It's kinda scary," right? SAS, SLR, FN rifle. Like, what are you, what are you afraid of? But it's, it's... And they would see- ... a lot of [01:17:00] wildlife. Now he said, we just looked at each other for a few seconds and just carried on our merry way. Um, a- and they say you'd see a lot of wildlife just sitting-

Travis Bader: Sure

Ian Sim: you do

walking, as we know when we're out.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Um, which is part of the whole experience. Hunting, I've never got an animal once. Well, bird, and a robin Scotland. I've been out with groups who've, we've got animals, but me personally, I've passed on a shot that I thought was unethical.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Golden. I, I don't... It's, that's probably one of my best hunting experiences.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um-

Travis Bader: It's good to pass on that.

Ian Sim: Good ... didn't take a bear last year. Uh, just, just too far. Straight out too far. Yeah. Um, I'm like, "Nope," 'cause I had a fixed four-power scope.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: So, but I'm not sure I can call myself a hunter. I hike with a rifle, but I'm not sure I'm a hunter. I'm joking. [01:18:00] But it's the camping.

Like, camping and hiking and being in nature, it, I call it vitamin N, vitamin nature.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: I've always spent time out trail ri- I live in North Van, so I can trail, I can hike. Like, I've never t- I've never run in cement for decades.

Travis Bader: See, I got vitamin C, which is Hawkins Cheezies. And I always take those out when I'm hunting, much to the chagrin of the people I'm with- Oh

'cause they come in those hard, crinkly bags, and they- I

Ian Sim: love those.

Travis Bader: They're, they're amazing. They're... And the number of Americans who's li- listened to the podcast and who've, uh, now asked- They don't- ... asked, "What is this Hawkins Cheezies thing you're talking about?"

Ian Sim: Oh, and they'll never be the same.

Travis Bader: Last time we were together was at the National Firearms Association's- Yes

AGM.

Ian Sim: Yep.

Travis Bader: And they had asked me to do a little talk there, which I did. You should do a talk for them because you've got a lot of ideas when it comes down to firearms, firearms laws, firearms policy, and of course we've got this, uh, court challenge that's coming up in a little [01:19:00] bit. Have you been keeping up on any of that?

Ian Sim: A little bit. Um-

Canadian courts and our, our, our legal system, I won't call it a justice system. I haven't called it that I think since like

Travis Bader: my- It's a judicial system. ...

Ian Sim: my first week in the RCMP, but

our courts and our policing are better than many parts of the world, the majority of the world. Having said that, there's room for improvement.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: As you well know.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: I'm on CKNW and have been for years, um, on a fairly regular basis if it's related to national security, terrorism, public safety- Mm

policing, things like that. My name is Sean. Yeah. I'm a police officer. They don't know who I work for or they, and they don't know where I work for.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Um, and I'm not hiding anything. Sure. It just allows me to be [01:20:00] Honest

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm

Ian Sim: Straight up. Not brutally honest, it's just honest. It allows me to w- without worrying about Ottawa headquarters in Surrey, someone taking offense.

Like, I'm not out to cause, uh, uh, any embarrassment or, or, uh, controversy as my dad would say, to the outfit.

Travis Bader: Controversy.

Ian Sim: But just, it- it's- it's not relevant to the topic. Mm. So it allows me to be as candid as I can and give the best answer that I can when I'm on CKNW.

Travis Bader: How do you find that?

Ian Sim: Uh, i- it's, it's, it was scary phoning in to CKNW because it's, I'm in the car and it's now.

Mm. And it's, "Oh, crap, what am I gonna say?" Right? I'm gonna be on there for 30 seconds and I'm gonna have to make something up.

Travis Bader: [01:21:00] Mm.

Ian Sim: Well, like my buddy said, "Dude, you could talk for three days." Mm. Like, but, you know, you've gotta pull over, you're driving, whatever. Sometimes I know the topic inside and out.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: And some days I do better than others. Mm. And other days I'm like, "Ugh, that didn't go well. I totally missed that, but I was in a hurry."

Travis Bader: But you get better the more you do it.

Ian Sim: Absolutely. So-

The talking, like public speaking-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: um, like I'll never shut up if it's just a few friends. But to a bunch of strangers or in a group or at the Justice Institute in front of all your peers-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: or at the, uh, UNBC-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: talking to all the municipal councils and mayors or... It's like that's different. But that's okay.

It's, I've presented, I have presented to... Well, CKNW, [01:22:00] I used to, I used to... Linda Steele, who is the wife of Norm Lapenski, who was the former chief constable at Surrey Police Service, she knew I was a cop. She knew me as Sean. She didn't know who I worked for or anything. So I would chat with her a fair bit.

She's not on CKNW anymore. Uh, CKNW phoned me one time to do a national show, uh, that evening for- on a policing matter.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: So I did it from my supervisor's SUV at UBC in the parking lot. Hmm. I just turned my radio off.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, it, it makes you better. It, it allows you to gather your thoughts sometimes in very short notice.

What are the key points, one, two, or three? Because you only got so long to talk. Like, what do you wanna leave them with?

Travis Bader: Have you talked at all about any of the, uh, the recent firearm stuff and the, the court challenges?

Ian Sim: Not as much-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: because I'm, I don't seem to be in my car as much.

Travis Bader: Okay.

Ian Sim: Uh, I would phone [01:23:00] from work if there's nothing going on and I have time.

Because I think part of my role as a police officer, as, as, um, public servant, agent of the state- First responder, I hate that term, um, is to give back to the community in non-enforcement ways. Like just being a g- a-

Travis Bader: Available and present ...

Ian Sim: available and present and a good ambassador. Yeah. So get out of your car, walk.

Mm-hmm. I was on a, a mountain bike section in North Van years ago. Um, th- that section doesn't even exist anymore, right? Resourcing, it's gone. I'm quite sure that the new bosses there would love to have it back, but it depends on Ottawa, it depends on headquarters in Surrey, it depends on the government fund.

It, it depends on a lot. Mm. But I think I owe it [01:24:00] to the people I work for. Like, I can remember being at the top of Trail 6 for Wreck Beach, 'cause I was in charge of policing Wreck Beach for- Mm ... I don't know, seven, eight years. I get, I get to UBC, brand new. Um, UBC had been in a bit of a mess for a couple years before I got there, but when I got there they'd had two new bosses.

The other guy was gone. Um, and, and good bosses. Um, one, and one was a bit of a legend in Surrey, he was awesome, and he's really good with people. And he said, you know, as he got to know me, he didn't take long, he goes, "You're good with people." And I said, "I like people." Still.

Travis Bader: Yeah, so far.

Ian Sim: Not as much. Sure. But generally, yes.

And he goes, "You're in charge of Wreck Beach." And I'm like, "Excuse me?" He goes, "You're in charge of Wreck Beach." For all these reasons, and he was right on all of them, so I, I guess I was in [01:25:00] charge of Wreck Beach. But standing at Wreck Beach, top of Wreck Beach one night. So Wreck Beach is a, is a, um, an interesting place.

It's, it's probably the oldest clothing optional beach in the country.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: There's real hippies there still, like, not just kind of want to be second, third generation. Like, there's real hippies that were probably at Ha- Haight Ashbury in '68. There's not many left, but so it's an alien planet, as I call it, within an alien planet- Hmm

which is the university itself, which is a, a left coast university. Doesn't matter, left coast, east coast universities are just interesting places. Hmm. So standing at the top and, and I get... Everyone knows me on the beach after years. Uh, and someone goes by, and then people go by and they go like, "Hey, boss."

And you know the difference between boss, the prison term, or-

Travis Bader: S- S.O.B ...

Ian Sim: boss.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Like, it's a term of respect, and you know the difference. Sure. You know who's saying it. You, you know them. Some, they become your friends. Mm-hmm. You be- you become either part of their community or they become part of [01:26:00] your community.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: But... A- and I'm like, so when they would say boss, and I know that they, they were, they were being respectful. The other time I knew when they weren't.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: I'm like, "Actually, you've got that backwards." And they're like, "Uh, pardon?" I go, "Yeah, you just called me boss. You've got it backwards."

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm. I work for you.

Ian Sim: You're my boss.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: You're my boss. I work for you, and I work for all those people. A- and, and that's just not a, a, a party line.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: That is how I approach my work. I work for you. Yeah, I, I, I have a head office, but I run a, for lack of a better word, a franchise. I'm the franchise owner, one employee.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: So I report to the organization, to the RCMP, but I work for you.

I don't work for them, I work for you.[01:27:00]

I will do the best job for you and them that I can do, no matter the semantics. But I work for you. Always have, always will. And, and, you know, we get into philosophical discussions on the beach. It's a university. Um, f- international students from all over the world. So, but at the core, that's it.

Travis Bader: Hmm. Yeah, I remember Wreck Beach, my only real experience there.

At nighttime, we had a party, I think it was early 20s, and- ... it was a party out of UBC, and they're like, "Oh, let's go have a beach fire. We'll go to this beach." And so we go down this long set of stairs all the way down- Yep ... to a beach, and they had booze and a big fire, and of course, as a young, in your 20s guy, you w- a fire is not just a little fire, it's, "Let's just get all the logs you can find and stack them up, and how big of a fire can we make?"

Yep. And-

Ian Sim: [01:28:00] Stay warm.

Travis Bader: That's right. Just massive fire down there on the beach. And, and, uh, ended up sleeping on the beach and waking up in the m- in the morning and just screaming and crying. Yeah. And it was, it was almost like a, um, a, a war movie and Adagio for Strings is playing in the background and people are just beside themselves.

And I'm like, "What's going on?" And people are coming up, they're pointing at me and this other fellow like, "You burnt down my house. You, this was my house." And like there was logs on the beach that some of them, I guess, were put in a bit of a square, and that became their house, and it was, it was kind of the end of the world for these people.

And-

Ian Sim: You know what? It's a colorful clientele.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: But, but so is the world around us.

Travis Bader: Totally.

Ian Sim: Uh, you know, I went to UBC for a number of reasons. Uh, they'd had a rough couple of [01:29:00] years with the boss. They had the detachment commander, I believe it was. Uh, and, and the operations sergeant. It was one or two, um, either/or. And they needed, um... So UBC is often very junior members, their first posting.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: So, uh, a gal I worked with at FSOC, Federal Serious and Organized Crime, she'd already gone over there and got her bump- got promoted. Uh, and she was a corporal in charge of, uh... She was the community- Yeah ... liaison officer there. So he goes, "Look, um, I know you always like to get back to uniform and this and that.

Um, we could really use a steady hand out here and, and, you know, some senior, uh, senior members. Come on visit. Um, we've got good bosses now. It's, it's, it's a very interesting place." And she goes, "I think you'd do well here." So yeah, I went out and, um- Uh, [01:30:00] was very quickly tasked to deal with Wreck Beach. So I wouldn't have it any other way.

It's, it's a, an alien planet within an alien planet, particularly during COVID, BLM.

Travis Bader: Well, you're the right person to be doing that down there. There's different personality types, and some of these- ... personality types would just be inflammatory in an environment like that. So that's, uh- Clearly somebody knew what they were doing when they, uh, thought of you as the person to be going down there.

Ian Sim: And, and the reason is, is this sergeant, uh, Sergeant Drew Granger. He's retired now. Um, he had a very well-deserved reputation in Surrey.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And then I'd heard of him, 'cause you heard about the problem children, you heard about the rock stars. Sure. And I'm like, a lovely man. Um, profe- like just on every level, professional, kind.

Um, you know, when it time to get down to rolling around, like just, [01:31:00] you know, he, he just had it all. And, and I was, again, lucky enough to work... A- and that's one of the beauties of policing, the military, a, a tight community. Yeah. Um, you don't like everyone in the office. They don't all like you. Um, but at the end of the day, for the most part-

Travis Bader: You're pushing towards a shared goal

Ian Sim: you're all professional.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Now, again, there's some unique individuals in our organization, like many who-

Travis Bader: Sure ...

Ian Sim: probably shouldn't be allowed to work with the public.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Put them in an office writing policy or something. Just, right? Uh, or, you know, they'll fight a, they'll cause a fight in an empty room.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So, uh, and yeah, so Drew was right because he ran the beach that way.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And it was a change from how it used to be run. It was very confrontational. Right. Us and them. They hated us. We hated them. It was mutual. Sure. It was awesome. Right? We'd come down on the beach or down those 500 stairs that are still there.

Hmm. They'd boo. We'd leave at the end of an hour, at the end of the night. They'd cheer. And they'd [01:32:00] cheer. Um, okay. So he, he turned that around. He thought, w- we don't need tough on crime and smart on crime. We need smart on crime.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And it's not that it, it was even crime. I mean, those are my words. But that kinda sums up, you know, when I hear-

Travis Bader: It's just a bunch of hippies doing their hippie thing down there

Ian Sim: for the most part.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: For the most part.

Travis Bader: For

Ian Sim: the most part. So police yourselves or we'll do it for you. What do you want?

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Okay. So if- A- and during COVID, so the world went home. The university just was a, a ghost town. It was like a sci-fi movie set, and I hate sci-fi movies. So it was creepy. But a lot of people started coming to the beach from, uh, further away, Surrey, and all these places that-

Travis Bader: Mm

Ian Sim: they're bored. Can't go to work, can't go to school. So the beach kinda grew and, and became quite a thing- Mm ... among people who weren't the regulars, didn't know the [01:33:00] rules, the, the, the convention, the culture.

Travis Bader: The houses. Didn't know the housing situation-

Ian Sim: The houses ...

Travis Bader: the squares at the-

Ian Sim: You know, uh, uh, Wreck Beach is kinda, it's chopped up.

You can't see it, but it's, it's balkanized.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And, um, you know, the gay men will be on that side, uh, as well as down the trail, and then, uh, the regulars or certain groups here, um, you know, the, the, the gay women tend to hang out over here a bit. The, the... It's just, there's all these, and, and you can use whatever terms you want- Sure

for whatever group you want. But they've already self, um-

Travis Bader: Segregated- Yeah ... policed, and got their own little-

Ian Sim: Yeah. And, and, and, but so for us to be able to

keep, maintain, and perhaps even build on or improve on the relationship on Wreck Beach, for me to be able to do that as an old, white, [01:34:00] colonial settler cop during COVID and BLM and all that stuff, we probably can do it anywhere.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: In any community in the country, on any reserve. It might not happen in the first day, first week, first month, but boots on the ground.

Travis Bader: And then hearts and minds.

Ian Sim: Or not.

Travis Bader: So, uh, LLDA, Last Line of Defense Act, have you had much movement on that?

Ian Sim: So th- I thought about it more after-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: your last podcast, and threw it out the window fairly quickly thereafter. The term LLDA-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: the Last Line of Defense Act, I was... Because I'd had time to think.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Talking makes me think, or I'm thinking while I'm talking. Sometimes neither, but I was looking at it as a, [01:35:00] kind of a federal, the chances of getting it adopted by a, a federal party.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Which under the liberals, one might think, hmm, not a hope. Uh, well, I'm not gonna give up anyways. Mm. If it's good policy, it's good policy.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: If it's sound policy, it's sound policy. I get some people are uncomfortable with it, certain topics, because of-

Mental health issues like anxiety, paranoia, political considerations, um, just it's uncomfortable. There's a lot of reasons why people will oppose policy.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh, straight up good intentions. Well-meaning, intelligent Canadians who honestly think that would be a terrible idea. That's okay too. [01:36:00] Um- I just thought that why try and convince...

There's, there's different levels of government, so why try and convince one party at the federal level to try out, um, the LLDA, the Last Line of Defense Act? And I, I kinda broke it up, and I'm not sure if we discussed it then. There's the civilian side, and then there's the people who are already carrying guns legally in this country.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: So now I've just kinda termed it off-shift carry for those who carry professionally in Canada every day: police, sheriffs, conservation officers, armored car guards, and even citizens who have an ATC, an authorization to carry.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: W- we could implement that provincially, 'cause p- policing's a provincial matter.

So let's say I don't have to convince Ottawa. What if I convinced Alberta and Saskatchewan [01:37:00] to give it a go? Say, "Look, we've got an issue with public safety in this country. It's not getting better. It's t- tanking still after 11 years of, of the liberals." Part of that's their fault. Part of it's just the way societies evolve.

So let's say Alberta and Saskatchewan wanted to watch liberals' heads explode in Ottawa. It's a sport. Just for fun. Just that in and of itself. They could say, "Well, we're gonna request that our police services in these two provinces have the individual option to carry their service pistol off-shift, off-duty."

Travis Bader: So and that would be a separate sorta ATC, or would that be- Nope ... tied in with the work?

Ian Sim: We, we, we carry our pistols home all the time. Right. We do it because we're on call. We do it because, uh, we're gonna work overtime on our days off.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh, [01:38:00] some lock their handgun up in the case and carry it home that way at the end of their shift.

Many members wear their whole uniform and service pistol home after their shift.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And that shift might be in plainclothes, so it'll be concealed, or it might be in uniform.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So but-

Travis Bader: So you're not suggesting, uh, anything different, no new ATC issuance for-

Ian Sim: No, there's no, there's no... Because-

Travis Bader: Because we've got, um, uh, four levels of ATC, for the listener anyways.

Um, principal activities, cash or negotiables, armored car. Uh, you're a trapper, and usually they'll give you something, uh, like a .22 or something you can dispatch animals in your traps with. Uh, wilderness protection And then there's gonna be protection of life. The first three that I mentioned are issued, uh, provincially, and then the protection of life one, they went in 2024, I think it was, and they moved that into, uh, federal [01:39:00] issuance.

So they moved that one out into one federal, uh, body, which might still have the province involved, whether you're an opt-in or opt-out province, what have you. Police, they don't need an ATC just in the same way that they don't need a firearms license in order to carry a firearm because given the Queen's Commission, King's Commission, um, they, uh, are able to, uh, be exempted from that one.

Yeah. So you would be looking at something basically in line with the work because like they say, a police officer's job never stops, right?

Ian Sim: Well, under the RCMP Act specifically, w- they own us 24/7.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: And within reason, I think that's legitimate. Um- Mm-hmm ... I don't think everything you do on your days off, uh, should be covered under that.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: But we should be held to a higher standard-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: without a doubt.

Travis Bader: I agree.

Ian Sim: As are teachers and people, other professions where you have, uh, you're in a position of authority.

Travis Bader: That's right. Doctors are held to a [01:40:00] higher standard, teachers, like you say.

Ian Sim: But there's one group of people in Canada that n- need to be held to a higher standard than even police officers.

Travis Bader: Yeah, the politicians?

Ian Sim: Are politicians.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: And they're nowhere near it.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So that is a systemic problem-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: in this country, among much of the world. But yeah, that's, that's a no-go. That, that's... Pierre Poilievre says, "I wanna make Canada the freest nation on earth."

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Okay, well, one-liners are kinda cute in advertising and thing.

Sure. You know? And that's maybe the start of the conversation. Um- But, but there's more to it. So, a- and no one in the media, to my knowledge, and I, I don't watch politics 24/7, but I've never seen or heard of, uh, uh, anyone in the media from any side, left, right, [01:41:00] mainstream, independent, say, "Well, Mr. Poilievre, you've said that you, you'd like to make Canada the freest nation on Earth.

Can you tell us within your first 90 days, six months, year, two, three, four things that, that you think that you could get done?" Um, in that vein to make, to enhance, uh, the freedom of Canada, right? Ob- obviously-

Travis Bader: He's been asked that ...

Ian Sim: you know, so I haven't heard, like, those answers much. Mm. And, and maybe I can't watch TV nonstop.

I work 12-hour shifts. Sure. All that stuff.

Travis Bader: I think he's got some, uh, some decent one-liners to come back to all of that. Yep. Whe- whether those one-liners pan out into- Mm ... something that's, uh, doable and makes sense. But they, they, uh, they definitely sound good when, uh, when asked and he says it.

Ian Sim: So, and I mean, I, I'm conservative.

Travis Bader: Yeah. Y-

Ian Sim: you know, full disclosure. [01:42:00] Um, I'm not far right. I'm not far left. I could probably, you know, uh, uh-

Travis Bader: I think most-

Ian Sim: I will find in common, like something in common with all of them. And when you're working the protest lines at Kinder Morgan, Fairy Creek, UBC-

Travis Bader: Mm ...

Ian Sim: you're down on Wreck Beach. Uh, you're sitting in a room with motorcycle enthusiasts.

Travis Bader: Fully patched?

Ian Sim: Um, I, I find it's helpful to find what we have in common.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: And use that as a starting point, a building block, a foundation Uh, humor, if nothing else. So you might not h- I mean, you're just sitting there looking like, "Do I like their car? Do I like their pit bull? Do I like their politics?"

You might not like anything. Like, you might be polar opposites.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Okay, well, then I guess it's just down to humor, right? Can we [01:43:00] crack that? And if you can, that's maybe the crack that you can open a bit more. And, and you're not, you're not there to pull a fast one on anybody. You're I mean, is the cup half full or is the cup half empty?

I'm a cup half full guy. Like I said, I would sit down with the devil himself or herself if that's what it took.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Right? Um, you know, the days of total war are over. The days of, of probably crushing, uh, a country with one or two bombs is probably over. It's a negotiated peace, but peace is worth negotiating, even if it is the devil himself.

So, so conflict is, is conflict, whether it's war, whether it's, um, guerrilla war, total war, interstate, um[01:44:00]

You know, we may hate each other, right? But, but can we leave this world a better place? And, and, you know, so wars come and go. Sometimes they drag on, uh, sometimes they end forever. There's conflict in my business, in policing.

Travis Bader: Well, we need conflict.

Ian Sim: Well, it's, it's natural. It's normal.

Travis Bader: We all need conflict in our life.

It's just how do we deal with that conflict? And some people don't know how to deal with it very well, and that conflict becomes a one thing that they focus on, that conflict compounds. But without friction, there's no fire. If everything's easy, then, then nothing's easy, right? Like you need, you need that comparative scale of the whole yin and yang.

You can't define white without knowing what black is, right? It'll- You can't define good without knowing what evil is, and-

Ian Sim: It'll always be there.

Travis Bader: Right, so

Ian Sim: you- It's the human condition.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So what do we do about it, right? Soft on crime, tough on crime. I just [01:45:00] kinda, ugh, 'cause you know kinda what side of the house they're coming by when you hear those terms.

Mm-hmm. You're just like, right. No, no, I'm interested in smart on crime. We have to be smart on crime, 'cause we're not very smart on it now.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So there's a lot of room to do better. I think, I think there's gonna be no shortage of work when I do retire because I think there's municipal governments, provincial governments, and federal governments that are doing it...

It's never good to probably walk into a big group and say, "You're doing it wrong."

Travis Bader: But you could be doing it better, and here's a way.

Ian Sim: So cup half full. Not you're doing it wrong, dumbass.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, you're doing many things right.

Travis Bader: Yeah, but wrong by what measure,

Ian Sim: right? Well, uh, so again, you have to be careful.

Like, the goal is, is to Give a level of government o- or corporations or businesses or even [01:46:00] community groups or individuals, give them, um, options that they can use, empower them. Uh, probably don't go in and say, "You're doing it all wrong." Probably say, "You know what? You, you're doing a pretty good job. Uh, I can help you do better.

We can do better."

Travis Bader: Yeah, I th- I think a shared understanding of what the desirable outcome should be, because I think quite often where my frustration has come when dealing with government bodies is not understanding we don't have the same shared outcome that we're looking at. Whereas I say, "That's completely wrong if you want to affect this," they might agree with me, but they're not trying to affect this.

Their, their head's in a completely different area, and it might be that they want just to get elected in or they want to appease or they want a soundbite that sounds good and something easy, 'cause we're, we're creatures. Animals have game paths. They take the path of least resistance that's safe. We're animals, and we do that.

So that's my starting point, is by [01:47:00] what measure? Can we at least agree on what measure honestly, because it's nice to say that this is our me- measure. Public safety is our measure. Okay. What does that mean to you, right?

Ian Sim: Systemic racism, any term you wanna use. Sure. Um, w- you know, we need to, we need to... I'm not interested in creating a plan until we've defined, clearly defined and agreed upon what the problem is.

Travis Bader: Right

Ian Sim: And then once we've clearly defined and agreed on what the problem is, we can start working on strategies to, that, that ideally, you know, are the either the cheapest to start with or the easiest to implement, or there's any number of factors you wanna look at. But-

Travis Bader: Yeah, I find, I find that the hardest part.

Yes. Like I, I... So, uh, Delta here, we've got a hunting regulatory advisory [01:48:00] committee, HRAC, and firearms and hunting kind of regulations in the city of Delta. I've sat on that board for years, and when I first came on, I'm kind of paying attention, trying to see what's, you know, the new guy here. Like, what, what's the process?

What do we do? And oftentimes maybe it's something they've talked about before and everyone's got this shared understanding. They kinda know where it is. Oh, the greenhouse over here, they've got broken glass, and so we're gonna have to put up signage and we're gonna have to move things out further or maybe put a no shoot zone.

Well, hold on a second. Broken glass from what, right? Was it hail? Was it birds pooping rocks out that came down? I mean, from the distance we're looking at, like, I can do the physics, I can do the math, and the shot sizes that are gonna be falling at that distance, and everything falls at 32 feet per second or 9.8 meters per second squared.

Like, uh, you're probably gonna have a difficult time attributing this broken glass to a shotgun unless you've witnessed it and they're within this X [01:49:00] distance. But that's not the conversation, and the conversation's already started from a step of, "Here's an issue that's been reported and we, we want to take the steps."

And everyone's really good at trying to problem solve those steps. But the initial, "Let's all get on the same side", maybe, I don't know, maybe the greenhouse people just don't wanna have shotguns around them. Maybe they attribute broken glass. I'm not saying that's the case, but it's, it's part of the process that should be looked at as you, uh, uh, as you start weeding out.

And once everyone has that shared understanding, then the solutions start to become pretty, pretty evident

Ian Sim: Easier said than done, as you know.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But, but you're

Travis Bader: right. And that, that's minuscule

Ian Sim: compared to- It's, it's... Yeah, it's... I was talking to a retired RCMP guy the other day, and he's all over animal rights and this and that.

Mm. And he's not so big on hunting and guns and stuff. So, you know, it's like conservation, uh, and we're, we're talking Africa.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And, you know, so we [01:50:00] can agree w- on, you know, uh, conservation goals.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: But how we get there, we may never agree, right? What place does hunting have in conservation in, we're talking about Africa

Travis Bader: It's massive

Ian Sim: Well, but his, he like, "No, what do you mean hunting?

No, it's all trophy hunting, canned hunting. It's just, it's all bad, evil, runaway." Again, I had a girlfriend who was a vegetarian and left-leaning social worker. We're still friends. Um, and we-

Travis Bader: We're still friends. Despite all of that.

Ian Sim: Over a decade later. And w- we were, we were open to each other's, uh, perspectives.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Right? Um, I don't mind. We can get into it if you want, but let's do it over a burger and a beer. [01:51:00] Let's be polite. Let's not hit each other with the mugs, and we'll do it again next week. But-

Travis Bader: Yeah, how does, how does hunting help it in Africa? Well, maybe through a, a not so obvious way, but the outcome is measurable.

The not so obvious way is, well, you just put a price on these animals and they become a commodity, and now that commodity needs to be protected. And without that structure in place, you wouldn't have those animals 'cause there'd be no protection factor for them. They would just be destroyed and shipped off for tusks and fur and all the rest.

So is it the best solution? Well, it's a better solution than a lot have been offered, and it's actually produced desirable results, so it'd be hard to argue against that one.

Ian Sim: But when you're dealing with people who are anxious or paranoid, that's, those are mental health issues, or have-

[01:52:00] for politics, for ideology, or, or just, it's just not their values. They honestly don't think that that's the right way to do it, and it might even be harmful No one likes to be challenged on their values. Very few people do. I, I like it. So CKNW, they'll call me out if I say something stupid- Mm-hmm ... or they'll have a rebuttal.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, as will y- your close friends.

Travis Bader: CKNW will or the other people?

Ian Sim: Well,

Travis Bader: whoever's- That you're calling in ...

Ian Sim: uh, all of it. All of it. 'Cause

they

Travis Bader: just moderate

Ian Sim: usually, right? Yeah. So, uh, but they'll have a guest speaker sometime. I talked to John Horgan-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: when they were talking about the grizzly bear, banning grizzly bear hunting.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: And I said, "Okay. Well, what's your plan if you ban grizzly bear hunting?" And I've never hunted grizzlies, but... And there's different types of hunting, I get, which, which that's fine. There's, there's all... There's room for everybody, but except poachers. Um-

Travis Bader: Well, that's not hunting.

Ian Sim: No.

Travis Bader: That's poaching.

Ian Sim: So I, I said to John Horgan, I [01:53:00] said, um, "What is your plan if you ban grizzly bear hunting?"

Because in jurisdictions around the world, and I'll use Kenya as an example, they banned hunting in 1977 for a number of reasons, and poachers just filled that gap. Mm-hmm. So how are you going to fill that gap? What is your plan for British Columbians if you ban grizzly bear hunting? Because if you ban grizzly bear hunting, you're going to need more, not less, COs to monitor the area, to take ownership for an area that the h- that the guides and outfitters and hunters and community already did.

So that's gonna be gone, and a lot of the revenue's gonna be gone.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Like, what- But- ... what's your plan? And of course, you know, it's CKNW, we're not gonna get too far into it, but they, they don't have a plan. Now, every country in Africa that either banned hunting and still has, Kenya, but a couple others tried it and have reversed that, [01:54:00] um- Again, uh, you know, there's a lot of talk about evidence-based this, evidence-based that

We have to agree. Ideally, I wanna deal with people who can get shit done. Now, in a big old conservative bureaucracy, you know, the only people that care about policy, RCMP policy, is the RCMP Government really doesn't do much The courts don't, judges don't, Canadian public really don't, right? We do.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: You know, dress and deportment, this and that- Sure

uh, it just goes on. Super important. We do some things very well, and other things, down the hall in the same building, crap the bed It's mind-boggling. I wrote a paper on counterterrorism policies years ago. Uh, I did my [01:55:00] terrorism studies through, uh, St. Andrew's University in Scotland.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And, um, my boss said, "Hey, you should send that paper out to some RCMP people.

There's lots of people that'd be interested." One, it's our core mandate, public safety. National security is also a thing. It's a whole division in the RCMP, uh, at headquarters, but also around the country. And yeah, there's, there's lots of people that, that, you know, is relevant to. So, you know, I was gonna send it to some of the firearms instructors, some other people, union set, national security.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And he goes, "I don't know, s- you know, why don't you just send it a little higher up?" I'm like, "Well, how high? I'm not gonna send it to the commissioner." He's like, "Yeah, no, I wouldn't do that either, but..." So anyways, on Friday I hit send to Ottawa as well as- Mm ... lots of other places, and to a bunch of people I knew, but to a couple of very high-ranking people that I did not know-

Travis Bader: [01:56:00] Mm

Ian Sim: that were in charge of some pretty big sections in the country, uh, federal policing and national security, just to name two. So And it was critical

Of, uh, certain policies. Not so much necessarily the RCMP, but just some of those applied as well. Like, I'm not gonna shy away.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: I didn't write the paper for the organization, right? Mm-hmm. I, um, you know- You

Travis Bader: wrote it for an end result.

Ian Sim: So when I got to work on Monday, um, there was some emails and, uh, one email was from, um, the head of national security who said, and I quote, who...

Well, he thanked me and said, uh, "And your conclusions are as sound as any." Thank you for-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: including me Someone else just down the [01:57:00] hall from that person at a very pretty high level, uh, didn't like it. And so I was called to the principal's office, uh, at headquarters in Surrey.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: So, okay, so, you know, you've got two people in the same organization in the same city, Ottawa, just down the hall from each other.

One thanked me and said, "Your conclusions are as sound as any."

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And the other one is like, "How dare you?" So I get called to the su- uh, the principal's office in Surrey. Like, where's Surrey? Anyways, um- And, uh, um, I'm in their office, and behind them is a TV muted.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And I was working at YVR on a criminal interdiction team at the airport playing close-

Travis Bader: Hmm

Ian Sim: uh, at the time. And the Olympics were coming up, 2010, critical national infrastructure, counterterrorism, I don't know, all that good stuff. And, [01:58:00] uh, and I think he kinda felt sorry for me 'cause he's like, "What am I supposed to do with you?" Right? He's former ERT.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, seems like a good guy, competent, like, you know, keen.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But he's like, uh You know, what direction does stuff roll downhill? I'm like, "Yeah, I, I get it." But on the TV behind him, uh, there was a live news feed of a terrorist attack, uh, on an airport in Moscow.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And I'm like, "Okay, well, I work at a federal unit at YVR. Um, it's critical national infrastructure, public safety, counter-terrorism.

The Olympics are coming up." And I'm, you know- ... uh, sitting here. And, and again, he, he was like, "Ugh."

Travis Bader: Wagging the finger.

Ian Sim: Well, again, he was, he was just passing on the message. Sure. He, he was just the [01:59:00] messenger. I think, um, based on his body language and, and his language, I think that, you know, there was a measure of respect there.

Uh, but he wasn't... He couldn't say it. He was-

Travis Bader: Fair enough.

Ian Sim: So-

Travis Bader: Pooh-poohs

Ian Sim: the email ... at the end of the day, I get a, um, a, a performance evaluation, a negative one for- Hmm ... and my crime or, or, um, was sending material without going through the chain of command. So very minor, as minor as it could be.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: But just kind of, you know, a- an aha moment.

Like, "Hmm." Um, you know, in theory, we, we, we talk the talk. Um, and this is, this, this can be a, a business, um, a company, a corporation, uh, a government.

Travis Bader: Yes. It... The RCMP is one big corporation- Yeah ... that's-

Ian Sim: So, um-

Travis Bader: Not [02:00:00] without its problems and its good stuff, but-

Ian Sim: I, I, I just, I went home and, or back, back to the airport and, you know, my boss is like, "What happened?"

I'm like, just, you know, showed him the thing. And he's like, "That's it?" I go, "Yeah." And he goes, "Cool." And then, you know, 'cause they knew. They saw the email from-

Travis Bader: Yeah ...

Ian Sim: uh, you know. And I'm like, "It is what it is."

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: But, you know, my standards I think are, are a bit higher. And, and when it comes to public safety, of which national security is a part, public safety is our core mandate of government at all levels, municipal, provincial, federal.

It's, it's job number one

Travis Bader: I, I think, I think that whole story, if I'm to suss through it just a little bit, might boil down to the same thing we're talking about before of are we approaching the issue from the same side? Do we have shared goals? Because maybe, just maybe, uh, your [02:01:00] letter hit it on the, the nail on the head, but it also brought it out of the shadows into light, something that they would have a difficult time not responding to, and maybe they didn't have the budget for it or they didn't want to do it, but now they c- feel compelled to have to do it, and it's, "Look at this person below us, and they've poi- pointed out this foible or this..."

And it's, um, altruistically looking at it like shouldn't public safety mean this, as opposed to, well, if you're gonna get promoted and this is on your desk and you never acted on it and this has been before you, what's that gonna do for you personally? May- maybe there's two different ways of looking at that same thing, and that's one thing that has taken me a long time in dealing with civil servants is finding a way to take my non-civil servant background and try and put myself in that head space of where is their head when they're looking at this.

'Cause maybe they wanna see the end result, [02:02:00] but is there a way that we can get them there without making them look silly? Or can we, can I paint them in a corner and give them a door out and make it look like it's their idea? I don't care.

Ian Sim: Make it a win for them.

Travis Bader: Right. There you go.

Ian Sim: Right? Um, you know, no one, no one wants to willingly take a loss.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So-

Travis Bader: Or make a decision, it seems. If you're in a position of authority with a re- Well,

Ian Sim: you might not be... it might not be your decision to make.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: In which case you're probably talking to the wrong person. Right. But, so when I was sitting in the principal's office, um, he's like, "You realize this could get out."

I'm like, "Ah, there it is."

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm. There you go. It's what if someone else sees this?

Ian Sim: And I like... And, and, you know, I s- I said, "To be honest," I said, "I thought this is just among us guys."

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Just among [02:03:00] us, right? The family. Sure. The team.

Travis Bader: Yeah. "

Ian Sim: Yeah, well, you know..." And I'm like, "Yeah, yeah, yeah." A- and again- That's fine.

They live at, they live in a different world at a different altitude.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: That's fine. Um-

Travis Bader: The perspective is gonna be different.

Ian Sim: Yep. And again, I came out of it, as far as I'm concerned, um, that, that was a win-

Travis Bader: Yeah ...

Ian Sim: for me. Like, I'm just, you know. So...

Travis Bader: But I think that's something that people can carry with them.

Like, a lot of the bureaucracy that I have to deal with is gonna be within the firearms program, and sometimes in the court system as a subject matter expert, or sometimes, like... And trying to navigate that, I, I think just that little bit of understanding of what you just said there, how do you find it so they get a win out of this?

Like, what does a win look like for me and for them, and where's that common ground meet?

Ian Sim: Well, a win in public safety benefits everybody.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: So we go back to what I was proposing, [02:04:00] the LLDA or, or now what I call off-shift carry or civilian ATC. The standard for off-shift carry or for civilians carrying handguns in Canada today are armored car guards.

They're civilians. Mm-hmm, that's right. They're not police officers. They're not- They've already got it ... screened the same. They're not trained the same. They, uh... And to my knowledge, I don't know, h- however many, let's say we have 5,000 armored car guards in Canada.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Okay. That's the standard, and it's a provincial standard, I believe.

Travis Bader: It's a federal standard now.

Ian Sim: It's not provincial?

Travis Bader: Issued provincially, a federal standard that was created. I think it was, um, Mike Messam back in the day put together a, uh, uh, a federal armored car use of force, uh, standard. Now, that said, uh, you can meet or exceed or deviate from that standard and meet the same guideline.

But they, but they do have a federal program that's set out- So- ... as a standard ...

Ian Sim: clear as mud.

Travis Bader: Yes.

Ian Sim: Fair enough. So if you [02:05:00] can't... I mean, just if you can't come in the front door, come in the back door. Come down the chimney.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: There's other ways to approach these problems. But let's say Alberta and Saskatchewan just wanna watch some liberal heads explode, and they say, "Well, we want our police services in our provinces, respective provinces, to have the individual choice, the officer has the individual choice to carry their service pistol off-shift."

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: That's it.

S- some, like, big city polices, Calgary, Edmonton, uh, will probably do what the province says and have a discussion, and there should be a discussion. How's that gonna look? What's it gonna look like? Do they need an extra permit? No, they don't. We c- we're already carrying guns to and from work-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: all day long.

Um, are they gonna need extra permission? No. Now, is there, is there an opportunity here, though, to do a one or a two-day concealed carry course? The RCMP now has a concealed carry course.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: [02:06:00] It's only been around for a couple years.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And I'm like, oh, better late than never. I was talking about that, I think the first week I walked into North End RCMP in 2000.

I'm like, "Do we have rifles in our car?" And they looked at me like, "You're not from around here, are you, boy?" No. And then I've been talking about these things for, for, for years. Mm-hmm. So if there's an opportunity, and, and now the RCMP has seen the need to fill a void, and it's, I think it's a two-day course, which should, you should be able in two days, you, I, Millbrook, we, we should all be able to write a, a, a course-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm

Ian Sim: and it would probably be much the same.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But if there's an opportunity to up our standards and training for the individual choice to carry off-shift, for off-shift carry, let's take advantage of opportunities to do that. Oh, well, you know, we'd need new training. Well, you're not gonna need much training because the RCMP is a two-day course.

Travis Bader: [02:07:00] Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Which is bet- I mean, we needed that course decades ago, but better late than never.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: So, but the RCMP in those two provinces, I'm quite confident would say absolutely not.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Now, it's their property, and they have the right, in my mind, to say absolutely not But then the provinces could also say, "Well, your contract's up in 2032, and-"

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So again, I'm getting a little bit out of my pay grade, but it's doable. Now, when I... There was a politician who advocated for off-shift carry of police officers. I've included peace officers and non-peace officers.

Travis Bader: Mm. '

Ian Sim: Cause if you're already out there carrying a gun all day long, you've met the provincial standard.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So if, if your armored car guards have met the standard, we have no trouble. If I said, "I want to [02:08:00] increase armored car guards across the country by 30,000," it wouldn't be news.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: It wouldn't make the news. It's not news.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But you would have 30,000 more people carrying handguns all over the place.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But again, not news But if I said, well, and, and some people, bureaucrats, Ottawa, would get all wound up about this. So maybe the RCMP in those two provinces say no. As is, I think they're right. But maybe Edmonton, Calgary, Regina police, they're all like, "Okay, what's this gonna look like?" Right? And it's not rocket science, right?

You can get it done in 90 days, this legislation, or just this amendment.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Right? Could we do the same things with civilians under the province now that your FACs or your PALs-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: with, um, the feds. But [02:09:00] let's say Alberta says, "You know what? Why don't we try a pilot project for civilian ATCs?" Or s- I don't know, name it whatever you want.

We, well- Sure ... there's wilderness carry. They're all ATCs. Sure. But we'll come up with a name.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: And what are the standards? Well, the same standards that exist today for all these guys and gals that are out there walking around with their, their guns.

Travis Bader: That's

Ian Sim: right. That's the standard. Now, the, the standards, I mean, again, not rocket science.

We need to be safe and we need to be competent.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: That's it.

Travis Bader: Un- understand the framework.

Ian Sim: That's it. Safe and competent.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: It, well, are we gonna make civilian ATCs more expensive or, or, or, or higher standards than the armored car guards? Well, no, we're not here to screw people. Mm-hmm. That's just another way to screw people.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: If there's room to improve the safety or the competence of our armored car guards, [02:10:00] sheriffs, conservation officers, police officers, or civilians, let's look at that. But let's not make it a one-month user course for a pistol that's gonna cost $30,000. Mm. You know, you're just-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So I mean, bureaucratic fuckery and all that stuff, uh, it's not my thing, but so Alberta could do that, but what if I told you there was a political party in Ottawa that proposed this as a private member's bill, that police officers be allowed to carry off-shift for all absolutely valid reasons?

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Every reason is valid. Um- When,

Travis Bader: when was that proposed?

Ian Sim: Or- Well, it actually was proposed-

Travis Bader: Yeah ...

Ian Sim: by the Liberal Party of Canada, by Dominic LeBlanc, a number of years ago.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: I printed off the one sheet. He had kind of a summary of it- Hmm ... and I'll... I'll have to track it down [02:11:00] for you. Sure. But, um, he, he said, "It's just common sense," right?

There's police out all over the country, everywhere.

Travis Bader: What was the opposition to it?

Ian Sim: Well, it's a private member's bill.

Travis Bader: Sure. Okay.

Ian Sim: And I'm sure it was crushed by his own party.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Right? But he, he's made all the same arguments that I've made.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: I've probably added on to some because I come from a counter-terrorism policing background, firearms instructor, all that stuff.

But I'm like, I just read his arguments, and they're, and they all make sense, right? Hmm. This would cost taxpayers nothing for off-shift carry. Okay? It, there might be some slight modifications in a, in an online training course for some theoretical work- Hmm ... prior to your one or two-day practical course, but now you've got your police officers trained up to a higher standard.

The Canadian public thinks that we're, we're all Navy SEALs or JTF or SAS. It's like w- we do the bare minimum- Mm-hmm ... in this country. We qualify on our [02:12:00] service pistols once a year. Bare minimum.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Many officers are highly professional, competent, safe, ex-military, current reserve military, um, grew up on the prairie shooting, right?

A lot of officers, it's just a, a, a necessary evil, and they have trouble passing their annual qualification. Now, giving us the most difficult to, pistol to shoot well under stress on the planet is- ... part of that reason, but that's now- That's

Travis Bader: changing.

Ian Sim: It's changing. The new pistol's coming in. The sad thing is, is, is I'm, when it comes to, I'm pretty patient, easygoing.

I don't worry about what the judges say, the courts say. Like, I'm just, uh, I, I will represent my franchise, the parent company, to the best of my ability-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: for the people I work for.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But at the end of the day, I don't control the [02:13:00] courts. I don't control the media. Like, I just, it's out of my hands.

Mm-hmm. So if there's an opportunity for us to, um, up our game, great. But, but, but again, we do the bare minimum many times. So Canadians think, oh, we're these, you know, ERT guys, all of us or something.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: And-

Travis Bader: Well, you're a cop. You must know about guns.

Ian Sim: Right?

Travis Bader: Well, maybe, but quite often, no. I mean, it's just one small part of the job.

There's so many other parts of the job that they need to know about.

Ian Sim: And, you know, I, I've presented- Criminology classes at Douglas College over the years, UBC, sociology, anthropology of all things, uh, the Justice Institute, uh, for police leadership. You know, they always say, "Why do you wanna be a cop? How did you get into policing?

Why did you want in? What made you want to become a cop?" Well, okay, I grew up watching war movies.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: [02:14:00] Adam-12, S- SWAT, Starsky and Hutch. I don't know. Cool stuff.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Um, I needed a job with no math. So I looked down the list that said, "Jobs that require no math." And I went down the list and it said, "Cop. No math, plus gun."

Fuck.

Travis Bader: No joke. You know why I'm standing here?

Ian Sim: I could do that math. And I'm like, "I'm gonna be one of those."

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Right? Um, and they said... And they, they, you know, they laugh. It's great. It's fun. Uh, and they said, but I wanted to live my life armed And most people don't know what that means What does that mean?

Someone will ask it.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Right? You have two of them. No, no. I wanted to live my life armed with a handgun[02:15:00]

And that's where the room can kind of go quiet at times. Uh, one time someone went, "Woo," like they're like-

Travis Bader: Sure ...

Ian Sim: they're from the prairies, no doubt. But- I said, "Yeah." And I said, "Well, what does that mean? What does that look like?" Now, I was at Gunsite in the '80s.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Um, uh, I mean, I still carry Milt Sparks holsters and a gun belt.

I met Milt Sparks-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: at Gunsite, right? Um- Happen- I happened to be wearing all his gear when I met him, which was perfect. But so yeah, I wanted to live... A- and I come from, so again, reading about World War II as a kid in elementary school, and it's just about planes, trains, guns, all the neat stuff- Yeah

the cool stuff. Um, what's this Holocaust thing? What's a concentration camp? You know, as you get older, you start reading more, and you start branching out. Um, and then I'm like, "Oh, well, that's [02:16:00] creepy."

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: You know, all, all the, all the p- political stuff that was going behind the scenes- Sure ... while at the same time that led up to it.

Travis Bader: And it always had disarmament as a, um, to, as a predecessor to the, uh, that have disarmament as something that happened before, let's say, the Holocaust, that happened before.

Ian Sim: It was part and parcel.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: Um, when the Germans invaded, uh, all of Europe, um, yeah, they, they rolled in, and it was a bit nasty for a bit and bombed and fought and stuff.

But then it was like, "Hey, this is for your safety. Hand in all this, this, this. Don't do this. Don't do that." Um, and the penalties were extreme.

Travis Bader: And that was your reasoning for wanting to-

Ian Sim: Yeah, I, I started- ...

Travis Bader: have a job armed ... I, I

Ian Sim: couldn't understand as a kid

First of all, they put all these people in a train and then killed them? '

Travis Bader: Cause that's the one thing that I think'll get a lot of people on their back foot. Hold on a second. He just wants to have a job [02:17:00] armed? He just, he just wants a gun. He just wants to have some power that's derived from having an object on his hip or-

Ian Sim: Well-

Travis Bader: What's wrong with this guy?

Why, why would he want that as opposed to wanting to live in a society where he doesn't need any of that?

Ian Sim: So again, uh, people are... Everyone's got an opinion. I get it. Sure. Everyone's got self-interest, and they've got, you know, um, anxiety, paranoia, ideology, politics, just good intentions, blah, blah, blah. I'm more interested in tell us more about that.

So I get it that everyone has an opinion.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But y- you're not really valuable in the room if, if, you know, we say, "What does that mean to you?" Mm-hmm. So people say, "Well, you know, you're into guns." Absolutely. Um, just like I'm into Community and public safety, seat belts, first aid

Travis Bader: Fire extinguishers.

Ian Sim: Uh, like I [02:18:00] said, yeah.

I said, "Yeah, this is..." You know, Ev- I can remember when I, when I had an interview through RCMP.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, and no secret that it was gonna get out that Ian was into guns. So when you're into something, it's often a negative.

Travis Bader: Or it's, yeah, it's given that negative connotation anyways. Of

Ian Sim: course.

Travis Bader: Right?

Ian Sim: So I, I got called in, uh, f- you know, for my background check, and, uh, "We heard you're into guns," right?

Uh, yeah Uh, and you can see her kind of fumbling. Um Uh, "Well, could you tell us more about that?" "Sure." So this is going reasonably well. Mm. She's, she's asking for. Um, you know, my dad was in public safety work for the federal government, fire protection, uh, engineer, all that stuff. Safety's been a thing, like, driven into me.

We had seat belts in our car in the '60s before seat belts were even in Canada. [02:19:00]

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And they were the race car style. Oh, yeah? Like the, the two clips and just like, oh, coolest thing ever- Yeah ... in our Austin, uh, Cambridge or whatever we were driving down the street in. But I say, "Yeah, so my background is all safety."

My, my dad, you know, when we were young and we traveled the province, we'd come up t- you know, to a, a train crossing. We'd have to take off our seat belts as kids, look both ways. "Is it okay, Dad?" You know, just all that stuff. Mm-hmm. So you know, I just explained that. A- and, and I said, uh And b- but before that, I also said, I said, "Well, what do you mean, like into guns?"

'Cause I was... I'm, I'm gonna have a bit of fun with them 'cause- Mm ... you know. "Yeah, what do you mean?" "Well," and this is where she was kinda, and I was just, uh, straight face, but I'm- Mm ... having fun.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: Um, "Well, we really just wanna know whether you have a healthy interest in firearms or an unhealthy interest in firearms."

Travis Bader: What's an unhealthy interest in firearms?

Ian Sim: [02:20:00] So I'm, I'm like, "Oh, this is awesome." Straight face. And I'm like, "Okay, Ian, 50/50 chance of getting this one right. So what was the answer again? Do you need to call a friend?" Like, and I'm just, uh, like, "Healthy interest." And she's like, "Okay." That's- And that's where she went Oh, can you tell us more?

Right? It was, it was funny. And I was having fun and, and I just, it, you know, it was all very serious, so. But I couldn't help it. I was giggling inside. And I just said, yeah, I just explained it. Um, I said, "You know, I know, I know we, we carry firearms. I know we deal with firearms, um, probably more than any segment of the population.

Safety's always been a big thing." I said, "I've tried to develop myself academically and physically for this job, for this career," I said.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And I said, "This is just part of it. Uh, I, you know, I've taken some firearm safety courses."

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: That's it. Some people don't get it. And, and that made sense because some people don't get it.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And she, "Yeah. Okay, thanks. Fuego." [02:21:00]

Travis Bader: Done.

Ian Sim: So I understand the concern, but again, the standard encounter is an armored car guard. We just gotta make sure that they're safe and competent. They are. If there's room, uh, and this is for the civilian side of the house that I'm talking about, um, off-shift carry at the very le- most, we might need, uh...

We do a lot of online training 'cause we're all across the country in the middle of nowhere.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: So if, if there's, um, some theory you can do before the course, 'cause like first aid, there's theory for lots of courses. Sure. And then we go and do the courses.

Travis Bader: Do a hybrid model.

Ian Sim: Yeah. So yeah, if, if we can up our game, um...

But I mean, I remember looking at my coworkers, uh, in plainclothes, uh, in North Van or even on the federal side of the house, Federal Serious and Organized Crime, with their plainclothes holsters. And I mean, we just called 'em the colostomy bag. Mm. Like, they stuck out about this far. Mm. Um, [02:22:00] and they had certain levels of retention.

Mm. And they didn't have a thumb break or anything, but, um... And I'm like, "You're not coming out on surveillance wearing that." Because we're, we're dealing with organized crime and gangsters who, who are violent, who are, are actively hunting and killing each other on a regular basis decade after decade.

A- and you're carrying a gun. Like, you can see you're carrying a gun. Mm-hmm. You're carrying something huge.

Travis Bader: Walking the dog.

Ian Sim: Um, so the issue holster, uh, while it may have met some safety requirements for, um, an admin person somewhere, the first sa- the first, your first safety thing is remaining covert.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: It's like you walking around Northern Ireland with, with clearly a pistol on your belt. That's not gonna fly. No. So [02:23:00] they don't know you're a gangster. We've got police officers that look like 14-year-old skateboarders-

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm ...

Ian Sim: and we've ... That, or, or look m- like m- more like any biker you'd ever met, right? Like, and everything in between.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So I said, "You, that has to change. You need to either dress for that holster and pistol," and our pistol's pretty big.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh, or we need to get a different holster, 'cause that's unsafe. Now of course, what happens is, is when policy doesn't match, um, realistic operational necessity, um, s- someone will step in and fill.

So there was, there's a gentleman who built Kydex holsters for the service pistol that we carry, and it was very popular.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Right? Inside the waistband, IWB, and if you're wearing the right clothing, um, you're good.

Travis Bader: Disappears.

Ian Sim: I, of course, wear custom Milt Sparks inside the [02:24:00] waistband, um, Mitch Rosen inside the waistband.

I may have them all in my bag as we speak. But, you know, so there's room to up our game, as I put it-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: uh, for concealed carry for all officers across the country.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Uh, so if we can take an opportunity to do that, let's do it. The new pistol, uh, you know, it'll all be new holsters, new all that stuff.

But-

Travis Bader: You chose a Glock, didn't you?

Ian Sim: We've got, yeah, so it's a Glock, uh, 45, and the 45 is the model number, not the caliber.

Travis Bader: Right.

Ian Sim: And so again, here we do some things very well in this outfit, and other things not so much. Um, our carbines, we've got Colt Canada C8 carbines. Mm-hmm. British and Dutch Special Forces use the Colt Canada ones because the quality's better than the American Colt carbines.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: We [02:25:00] took an excellent, not sure I would've chosen it, but we, we have taken a, a, a good proven, um, platform, foundation, and then we added bits and pieces on it. We added, uh, we had condiments or accessories- Mm-hmm ... or whatever. And they're, every one of them isn't, there's no bling. There's no pimping out your gun.

They're, they all enhance the use of that tool, which is actually PPE It's emergency safety equipment. So we put on backup folding sights, good ones. We put a nice proven red dot sight on it. Uh, retractable stock, a new pistol grip, more ergonomic- Mm-hmm ... more comfortable, the whole bit. Um, just everything you want on it and nothing you don't.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Now of course, you know, some people [02:26:00] want all kinds of things, but so w- we really knocked it out of the park that way. So same with the Glock. Now you may n- not like a Glock or you may whatever, but I, I shot a, my first Glock, I was on one of the protective courses in the States in the mid-'80s.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Right?

Travis Bader: That was when they were made out of porcelain.

Ian Sim: You know, we, we didn't, I don't think we started, we didn't, we started with our semi-automatic pistol, I think in '94.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But our Glock is light years ahead of the pistol we're carrying.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: And you can get used to anything.

Travis Bader: It's got the 5946 right now.

Ian Sim: Yeah.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: So-

Travis Bader: I've done a lot of work on those ...

Ian Sim: I can hide my 5946, 'cause I buy custom-

Travis Bader: Mm ...

Ian Sim: leather holsters. So I tucked away my 5946 at YVR in my shorts and this shirt actually.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Um, it's not the best shirt for concealed carry, but it's cut straight.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: It's a heavier material. It's black, and you're probably looking at [02:27:00] these.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Not down here. I, I have better shirts to wear. Yeah. And I'm wearing a cons- uh, a custom holster for concealment. I can tuck that 5946 away. No one ever saw it, ever. And I just wore shirt and shorts and a ball cap at, at YVR. Um, I've got two full magazines, 15-round magazines. I've got a handcuff pouch. I've got a cellphone pouch, 'cause we didn't carry radios.

You know, um, I didn't clip my knife on my belt unless my shirt hit it because we don't want-

Travis Bader: Right ...

Ian Sim: people to tell. But, um, but yeah, that, that, so that, you know, like before we've even left the office, you got people trying to leave the office w- with that gun that's... And then someone put it in her purse one time, and then she actually had to pull it, and she didn't know, like it-

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: I don't like firearms being, I like them to be on your person.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: I don't care if it's, um, appendix. I can't do appendix just [02:28:00] because little bit of this.

Travis Bader: Abdominal enhancement.

Ian Sim: Right. Um- But, you know, and, and that will be a policy decision, right? I mean, I can live with four o'clock carry.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But so yes, if we can, and I don't know what we're carrying in plainclothes right now anyways, 'cause I'm not in plainclothes.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Uh, you know, we've had improvements as we've gone over the years. But this new Glock pistol, um, it, it's not gonna have a 12 to 14-pound trigger. Uh, so for a, for a bean counter or someone, you know, a, a, a bureaucrat who's all about liability, well, we can't have a hair trigger, right? I would never give cops a single action anyways.

But when I trained in Gunsite in the early '80s, um, our counter-terrorist team, which was RCMP at the time, they had SIGs. Mm-hmm. Uh, DASA.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: Double action and then single action for every pull after. Uh, so I bought a SIG, and I rocked that thing down at Gunsite. But Jeff Cooper was so funny. Jeff Cooper [02:29:00] obviously liked single action only.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Preferably a 1911.

Travis Bader: Preferably.

Ian Sim: The Browning Hi-Power, mm, he might give you a nod maybe. Depends on the weather. So Jeff's like

Travis Bader: Yeah, that was my first pistol, Browning Hi-Power.

Ian Sim: Uh, in the Reserves or your, that you owned?

Travis Bader: That I owned.

Ian Sim: Oh, nice. Yeah.

Travis Bader: I

Ian Sim: wish I had one. Um, Jeff said, "Well, there's options. You don't have to go for your double action trigger pull to start with."

'Cause it's awkward going from a double action to a single action. Uh, you need to be careful with a single action handgun, um, a, a more mature, well-trained shooter. Um, same is true I think with the double a- DASA. Um, 'cause it's, and it's awkward. It's, it's a, it's a weird... You can get used to anything. And then there's just straight double action only, which is ours.

So I understand why they want double action only for, from a safety point of view. But- [02:30:00] This is the safety

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm

Ian Sim: This is partly the safety, but so, you know, I, I get it. Um, but, but what happens when you get into a critical incident and the stress is through the roof and you're clenching your sphincter so tight that it's affecting how your eyes are wor- Like, it's just-

Travis Bader: Yeah, you got

Ian Sim: a sympathetic clench

real world, real world, um, r- um, consequences. Sure. So if I don't hit my target with every single round, bullets don't care. They just keep going till they hit something. It's a to whom it may concern. They don't care. So if you've given your officers the most difficult pistol to use well under stress, I know, what, 15% of officers in the States miss, right?

And again, there's lots of reasons for that, training, [02:31:00] equipment- Mm ... all kinds of stuff. But, you know, the amount of stress in a real r- gunfight, never been in one, pulled my gun a couple times, um, it's stressful.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: And no one's even shooting at me.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: So there's a lot going on. We can alleviate all that through proper training, but proper equipment makes a difference, too.

Travis Bader: Yeah.

Ian Sim: So if our trigger pull... And I don't, no one knows what the trigger pull is. I, I can't find out, and I haven't really asked yet. Um-

Travis Bader: What, on the 5946 or-

Ian Sim: No ...

Travis Bader: the .45?

Ian Sim: The, uh, Glock 45.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: Uh, VPD I think's got about an eight-pound trigger.

Travis Bader: Yeah, whether they're putting that, uh, New York, uh, spring in there or what.

Ian Sim: Vancouver or us?

Travis Bader: You.

Ian Sim: Are we?

Travis Bader: I don't know. That's what I'm saying. Oh,

Ian Sim: yeah,

Travis Bader: yeah. Like, whe- whether- So

Ian Sim: again, uh-

Travis Bader: That w- that was... So I was in, um, Smyrna, Georgia at the Glock factory. Yep. And, um, they were talking about that New York trigger, and I guess Gaston Glock's like, "Pfft, no way." New [02:32:00] York's like, "We wanna have a, uh, heavier trigger pull."

He's like, "No, it's perfect. We got the r- just the angle of how we set it up. You can have different, uh, trigger pulls. There's absolutely no need for this New York trigger pull. We're not making it." They said, "Well, we have this many guns that we wanna buy and put it in." He says, "Not a problem. We'll make it."

Ian Sim: 50,000.

Travis Bader: That's right. Yeah, yeah, of course. So-

Ian Sim: So,

Travis Bader: uh- And then everyone else started picking it up, too. Yep. The one thing that the manufacturer said, "No, you don't need it. You don't want it."

Ian Sim: If, if, if our trigger pull is, let's say, eight pounds on the new Glock- It'll be a game changer. I've been shooting mine for 27 years.

I'm a firearms instructor, I've done a counter-terrorism program. There was just a lot of shooting. I shoot it well. I even had one of the Millbrook ex-GTF guys go, "Dude, I have never seen anyone so smooth on a double action before." Right? Why, thank [02:33:00] you. But that's not everyone, right? I put the time, the interest, all that stuff.

You have to dumb it down, and maybe dumb it down's the wrong word, but we need to, we need-

Travis Bader: Accessible to the masses ...

Ian Sim: and, and we need it, we need to give our, our, our, our people the, the ability to succeed.

Travis Bader: Hmm.

Ian Sim: And they have to have the confidence in those tools. So we g- we're gonna have a light underneath it, we've gonna have a, a, a nice, uh, red dot sight, Acro P2 I think, supposed to be pretty good.

I've never used a red dot on a pistol, so I'm a bit- Hmm ... I'm very curious. It's gonna be weird in a good way. So more people will qualify on this pistol, fewer people will fail. So that alone is, is a win for an organization. Time, money, all that stuff. But it's also a win for the user because their confidence goes up, their stress goes down.

It's also a win for the Canadian public-

Travis Bader: Hmm ...

Ian Sim: because there'll be fewer [02:34:00] misses 30,000-foot view, big picture. I remember a sergeant saying when the carbines were coming, uh, the patrol rifles, "Oh, I don't think we should have those. I don't trust, uh, members with, uh, these."

Travis Bader: Yeah, that's the wrong mentality, or you're hiring the wrong people.

Ian Sim: You are in the wrong line of work.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: But I would suggest, too, that, and there are police officers, I have colleagues, that oppose off-shift carry. I go, "What do you care?" Everyone's carrying to and from anyways now- Mm ... because they're on call, they're traveling up to the fires, they are gonna work overtime on their days off.

I know members that just carry their service pistol. I have no concern about it whatsoever.

Travis Bader: They are- People don't like change, though. I mean, you start-

Ian Sim: Again- ...

Travis Bader: suggesting something that changes or deviates from the status quo, and you're gonna get your-

Ian Sim: Which is fine ... resistance When it comes to maybe the [02:35:00] shirt you have to wear.

Actually, no, we'll get into that, too. This is, this is police and public safety. So I'm a very tolerant guy, pretty chilled, easygoing, good-natured. I just am. I'll hear, uh, like I said, I'll sit down with the devil himself, herself. Um, we can find common ground on these things, but- To be fair, a lot of people who make, who have an opinion on things have no idea.

Sure. Their opinion is based on nothing more than their own opinion.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: That's fine. Yeah. I get it. I get that you're honestly concerned about conservation of animals, even in another country. I get that you're concerned about officers maybe carrying guns on days off, but you don't have anything to offer the conversation.

If it's just, you know, whether you're gonna vote for it or not, and w- you're not gonna vote for it, right? I'm not gonna poll, poll you. You don't get to vote on it. Supreme Court doesn't poll Canadians. You don't [02:36:00] get a vote.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: They'll do what they're gonna do, right? And their job is to just, essentially it's either constitutional or it's not.

Their job isn't to decide whether it's good policy or not. It's not. They're doing it, I get it, but that's not their job.

Travis Bader: Mm-hmm.

Ian Sim: They've c- way crossed the line, and there's unintended consequences when you pass legislation.

Travis Bader: Sure.

Ian Sim: Sometimes those unintended consequences are of the good kind, and some are horrific.

And clearly human beings aren't that good at predicting which one you're going to get. Mm. Sometimes it's both.

Our courts have lost credibility as the whole legal profession. Prisons, [02:37:00] police, courts, Crown Council. Uh, again, in a rich Western democracy, well after the Enlightenment, well after World War II, many things, most things in society are better. Science, technology, uh, just, you know, out with the old, in with the new.

It's just, you know, th- those barf bags, the new barf bags are spectacular.

Travis Bader: We've come full circle. I love it.

Ian Sim: But look at laws and crime and policing and courts and prisons. It's like we're still back 100 years ago, and it's never evolved. Yeah, we've got helicopters now. We've got semi-autos instead of revolvers.

Like, there's a lot of things that have improved And I'm, I'm, I'll be the first one to sing our [02:38:00] praises or what I think are our praises in, in terms of national security, public safety, police and public safety, uh, all kinds of things. What we do right. The carbine, the pistol, and there's lots of other examples But that doesn't prevent me from calling us out where we shit the bed.

Travis Bader: I 100% agree.

Ian Sim: On that note, T in, T out. I don't know if that's biology or gravity- ... or both, but why don't we take a break?

Travis Bader: Ian, it has been absolutely fantastic. Thank you again for being on the podcast.

Ian Sim: I ha- You know what? I've barely touched the surface- Yeah, I know ... strangely enough. I know. Um, I've got a goodie bag here, which will have to wait till next time, and Yeah.

Um, I've had this time off from work. Yeah. I'm looking forward to going back to work soon, just long enough to retire properly. Uh, [02:39:00] looking at going consultant, probably open a consultancy myself. I know there's lots of firms, and a couple people are asking me would I come over.

Travis Bader: Mm.

Ian Sim: Um, people are saying, "What's your, what's your company gonna be?"

I don't know. I'm... So as I've been off work to get rested and healthy, and then the stroke's just- Mm-hmm ... icing on the cake, screwed everything up, put me back six months probably, um, I've been practicing for the next chapter-

Travis Bader: Mm ...

Ian Sim: which is retirement.

Travis Bader: Well, I got some thoughts on that, 'cause you and I were talking about that too, but we'll probably have to, uh, have those conversations on the next

Ian Sim: podcast, 'cause

Travis Bader: I think it'll be interesting.

My bladder won't hold out. I love it.

Ian Sim: Cheers.

Thank you.