Silvercore Podcast 133 Greg McHale

[00:00:00] Travis Bader: I'm Travis Bader, and this is the Silvercore podcast. Silvercore has been providing its members with the skills and knowledge necessary to be confident and proficient in the outdoors for over 20 years. And we make it easier for people to deepen their connection to the natural world. If you enjoy the positive and educational content.

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[00:00:52] Travis Bader: I'm joined today by a true modern day explorer and Hunter. He's not just a world class adventure racer and pilot, Silvercore. He's a steward of the wild with his own plane as his wings. He ventures deep into the Yukon untouched back country, revealing its hidden treasures through his show wild Yukon. He showcases a power of nature and our deep connection with it through exhilarating adventures, breathtaking scenery, and heartwarming family moments.

[00:01:18] Travis Bader: Welcome to the Silvercore podcast, Greg McHale. 

[00:01:21] Greg McHale: Thanks Travis. I really appreciate you having me here. Um, yeah, thank you very much. 

[00:01:26] Travis Bader: Well, I'm glad to have you here. And we got Colter here in the corner. He's just off camera, but, uh, you're in town for some hockey and it's good to see the, uh, at least some of the family out here.

[00:01:36] Greg McHale: Yeah, no, it's, uh, it's quite often actually that we're down in Vancouver with, uh, hockey for the young lad. And so it's just a great experience whenever, you know, the family is very dedicated to, to each other. And we, uh, spend a lot of time at the arena and it's, uh, yeah, it's just a lot of fun and it's always great to get down here.

[00:01:55] Travis Bader: Well, that whole family aspect really comes out in your show. Uh, Whether you're out there hunting with Coulter, you got your father out there as well. Your friends, friends and family play a really big role in what you're doing there. How do you find that the whole filming and the media and all the eyes on you and the family side, like I've personally tried to keep most of that separate for myself.

[00:02:19] Travis Bader: You're quite integrated in there. How, how do you find that? 

[00:02:23] Greg McHale: Um, yeah, it was, I don't know that I would say it was a very, you know, I don't know. necessarily a conscious decision. It's really just evolved because I just needed to be true to who I am. And you know, the, the program it's, it's really certainly evolved to just be a reflection of the world that I live in.

[00:02:44] Greg McHale: And. You know, I spend spending time in the outdoors with the family is so important to me and just spending time with the family, whether it's, you know, at a hockey rink or whether it's a soccer field or whether it's out, uh, out hunting. Um, so really. It's, uh, it has been, it's certainly, there's challenging moments when you have, when you're trying to produce a television show with your family and, and everyone forgets that, uh, especially my father forgets that there are cameras there, which, which can be good and it can be bad.

[00:03:18] Greg McHale: Like you want authenticity. It's, it's, you know, what, uh, really. What is the foundation of, of what Greg McHale's wild Yukon is, I believe. And so, you know, my dad could be a bit of a character and, and, you know, you get the, you get my wife and the kids and especially like Coulter, he doesn't talk a whole lot.

[00:03:36] Greg McHale: He, he's, um, he's a little bit more, More stoic and reserved than maybe my father and I, but at the same time, you know, he's very dedicated and it's just, it's, it's so much fun. And those are the really the best, those are the best shows for me because certainly when I started out Travis, it was, it was more like really.

[00:03:58] Greg McHale: Kind of hard hitting and really physically demanding and the aviation side of the show, it was really important along with, you know, just pushing the human body and more of adventure race style, right? That's kind of where I started, started out. And I still do that, but, um, it's, you know, As the kids have gotten older and my father's, you know, getting older, it's like really important that to me and that this is how we, this is what we do together and we go into the outdoors and we challenge ourselves and we, You know, have fun with it.

[00:04:35] Greg McHale: And that's why that's, you know, kind of how it has evolved with, but I still try to, um, try to get out there and push it for myself too. 

[00:04:44] Travis Bader: You know, when you look back in life, when you get older and you're not getting out, do you want to look back and say, man, I sure got to that top of that mountain pretty quick, or man, I carried a heavy load where other people couldn't, or.

[00:04:56] Travis Bader: Man, I sure enjoyed myself. I was out there with my family. I was out there with my friends. Where do you find, cause I'm sure you look at the metrics, I'm sure you look at the people who've been following you. So if, when you start out, you know, showcasing the flying in, you're a pilot, you got your pilot's license, so you can hunt, so you can go to these remote areas, showcasing the plane, showcasing the endurance side of things.

[00:05:18] Travis Bader: That's going to attract a certain kind of viewer and audience. Yeah. Uh, when you start transitioning to more the human element and the family side, how, how have you found that just out of my own personal curiosity, that impact on the following and the, the audience? 

[00:05:34] Greg McHale: Yeah. The, um, the impact of the family and certainly the characters within the family, um, are, are hugely impactful.

[00:05:45] Greg McHale: Like most people don't, um. So it's definitely more popular with the shows that have my father and the kids and my wife involved when versus me just out there pushing myself because it's really difficult for people to understand what, you know, what a 30 mile hike feels like over, you know, rough terrain.

[00:06:08] Greg McHale: By a map and compass, essentially. And, and it's really difficult for, for people that don't do that to really understand it, but everybody can understand being it, you know, out there hunting with your father, who's in his seventies or your son who is, you know, 10 years old, seven years old with his grandfather, every, that human element is really what people can connect with.

[00:06:31] Greg McHale: And, um, that's, like I said, it wasn't, certainly wasn't something that we, I really. You know, focused on, I got to bring the family in here. Uh, but it was just, it has, that was such a great element of it. And so much more satisfying to me. Like I can do these 12, 14 day hunts and come out successful at, but it's nothing like the watching your son kill his first, you know, mountain goat.

[00:06:59] Greg McHale: And being part of that and just working together, getting up the mountain, or you're watching your 70 year old father kill his first doll sheep, like, and, you know, just with your son and the last, last year, the whole family, we all went out sheep hunting, my daughter, my wife, and my son and I, and the four of us went out.

[00:07:20] Greg McHale: And, you know, we, We killed a ram and it was just such a great experience and watching my daughter for the first time, hold a, you know, hold the sheep heart up and be part of, you know, dismantling it, knowing where that meat comes from. Those are, those are special times that I think a lot of people that hunt can really relate to.

[00:07:40] Greg McHale: And that's what makes it special for me now, being able to just show the, how the importance of involving your family in the outdoors. And in, in the hunt or whatever it is, whatever your thing is, get the family involved and experience it together. And that's what it's about. And that's what I think that people like.

[00:07:58] Travis Bader: Yeah. You know, in such a disconnected time where people get their, their meat from the grocery store, I mean, it comes wrapped up in cellophane. This is, this is where meat comes from, right? Everything, they don't see the abattoir. They don't see the butchers. They don't see everything's behind closed doors, having that personal connection.

[00:08:16] Travis Bader: And realizing how close we are to nature and that personal connection to our food, I think is hugely important. And not everybody's going to have the ability to go out on these wild, super remote hunts with their family. Uh, but I think. I do think that people have the ability to at least educate through watching your show or other shows or going out to the butchers and going out to the farms, talking with the farmers, seeing where the food comes from.

[00:08:42] Travis Bader: I do think people have that ability to form that deeper connection. I know when I was, um, my kids were younger, it was really important to us. My wife's a chef by trade and. Um, you know, we're watching the kids and they're eating their food. And there's only so many times we can emphasize, come on, you got to respect where this comes from, eat your food on, on it goes.

[00:09:04] Travis Bader: And we took them out to a farm and we had a Berkshire pig that a friend of ours was raising. And. And took him out to the farm. We had them there for everything minus the, uh, the, the bullet in the head. I took him around the corner for that. But, uh, other than that, they got to see it dragged out, got it out, butchered up and spent a few days up there.

[00:09:25] Travis Bader: And I think those little moments, uh, Aren't shocking to somebody, but they, they make the children appreciate more deeply what it is that they're perhaps wasting on the plate. 

[00:09:37] Greg McHale: Yeah. And that, like what you've done is absolutely unique. Um, it's far easier for a hunting family to be able to, to go and do that, but to take the step that you did is, um, is.

[00:09:51] Greg McHale: Like, I commend you is, is phenomenal because that is like, we don't think deeply enough. I think generally speaking, we don't think deeply enough, especially when it comes to where our food is coming from and you know, the, the importance. Of, of the nutrition that you're putting into your body, or for your whole life, but then when we start to talk about meat, and what it's really, you know, where does this meat come from?

[00:10:16] Greg McHale: Well, this is where it comes from, and this is how it's processed, and you need to, and when you understand, you, um, You have an appreciation for it's really difficult not to have an appreciation for those who go out and harvest their own or get their, you know, kill their own animals in the field and then bring it home and feed the family with it.

[00:10:36] Greg McHale: So that like, I've never, you're, you're a unique, you're a unique individual. And I think that your family is very fortunate for what you've, what you've done to them. And I wish that more people would do that. 

[00:10:48] Travis Bader: Well, there's one of our past podcast guests, a Lieutenant Colonel, sorry, Lieutenant American Lieutenant Colonel Dave Grossman.

[00:10:55] Travis Bader: And he's written a few books, uh, on combat is one of them on killing is another, uh, one of his most recent ones that he was helping write, uh, was called on hunting. And that's what we're talking about. Years ago, he wrote on killing and, you know, he's had people look at this and some people a hundred percent agree, and some people don't agree, but he says, looking at school shootings and looking at, um, you know, Uh, some of these massacres that are happening, he says, He relates it to a disconnect in the value of human life.

[00:11:27] Travis Bader: Some of the things he puts towards that are, uh, video games, uh, or media, which seems to glorify violence or glorify shooting. And he says, you know, you want to inoculate soldiers to killing. Yeah. Here's a target, shoot it. It goes down target, shoot it. It goes out and you gamify it. Right. The gamification of killing.

[00:11:45] Travis Bader: And I don't think playing video games will make a person into a killer. Um, and that's one area where he's had a lot of critique. It desensitizes us though. But there is a desensitization. I agree. And the other one was how death is behind closed doors. They don't, they rarely have open caskets. You don't.

[00:12:02] Travis Bader: You're not on the farm, seeing the animal get raised. You're not a part of that process of the food. Even, even the food they grow, most people aren't growing their food. And he thinks that it creates a, um, an illusion in people's heads. Like this, this just isn't real. It's disconnect. Right. And he says that hunting will take a, Not only a greater appreciation for your food and for work, your role in the environment, but a much greater appreciation for a human life as well.

[00:12:33] Travis Bader: Yeah. And I, I agree with them there. 

[00:12:35] Greg McHale: Yeah, no, you know, I never, I haven't necessarily thought about it like that, but when you, when you see, like, I don't love the killing part of the hunting. Like it's, it's not, it's not something that, that when, like, I feel the remorse of, of the death and, and I think that that is, um, but I also know that it's, it's necessary.

[00:12:59] Greg McHale: It's part of life. It's part of, of us as humans. It's part of, you know, the, the nature and we are part of nature 

[00:13:07] Travis Bader: and 

[00:13:08] Greg McHale: we eat meat. And in order to, to consume meat, something has to die. And so when I, you know, I try to be very respectful of, of the animal. And, um, sometimes I'm quite disappointed when I see other people within the industry who don't treat it that way.

[00:13:26] Greg McHale: Um, for me, it is so important to instill in the children and instill in my family and the people that, that watch my show, that take the time to, to sit down and watch my show, that they know that they're not going to get from Greg McHale, this. Um, sure. I'm happy. I I'm, I'm when you put in so much effort toward a certain goal, there's a, there is an elation and a happiness when it is done, but there's also, it must.

[00:13:56] Greg McHale: Be directly related to a respect and the respect of, of the animal and the respect of what you, what you have done, you've taken the life and then what did, what that life is going to go to, you know, it's going to go to feeding the family. It's going to go to feeding other families or, um, but none of it is going to be for waste and that's what's really important for me, but I do understand.

[00:14:19] Greg McHale: And that, that would. Directly correlate to, you know, to understanding the value of a human life. Um, and when you, so if, when you are desensitized through media or video games or whatever, and you don't have that, that respect for, for, you know, the kill is just, is the glory and it can, I think that it can desensitize people to, to, you know, to the, the death of a human too.

[00:14:47] Travis Bader: Well, I think that's something that in the past, a lot of hunting shows had a difficult time portraying because people, non hunters would look at this and say, man, look at this person. They're so excited. They're just glorifying killing animals. And these people might be meat eaters as well. And they go get their food from the, from the grocery store.

[00:15:06] Travis Bader: But that human aspect, which we've been seeing like a meat eater, uh, Steve Rinella and the crew and, uh, showing a more human side to things, showing the failures, not just all the highlights, the hit reels, the, uh, the success points, but showing the struggle in between. I think that the, um, hunting media in general, or at least the stuff that I've been seeing your stuff in particular has been doing a phenomenal job of telling that story, the death part.

[00:15:35] Travis Bader: That's a fraction of a section second, if it's done correctly. Pulling of a trigger and then waiting for the animal to expire. Um, but all of the work that surrounds it prior to, during the emotions and after, I think that's, that's something that you have been doing really well with your show. 

[00:15:54] Greg McHale: Oh, great.

[00:15:54] Greg McHale: Well, thank you. Um, I appreciate that because that is certainly one of the more important things to, to me and to us as a team that, um, That we, you know, we are authentic to, to what it is that we're doing. And, you know, it's, it's, it's sometimes, and this is what people don't like to hear, but, you know, in the real hunting world, sometimes it isn't always one shot and it's done 

[00:16:18] Travis Bader: like.

[00:16:19] Greg McHale: And that's, that's just not realistic life. And, um, that is life. And we try to, uh, we try to do our best to, you know, portray the reality of, of the situ of the situation without obviously offending and, you know, bringing out too many anti hunters, uh, because they don't, because they don't understand. Um, so there is a fine line that has to be, that I think has to be, uh, made.

[00:16:47] Greg McHale: You know, drawn there and do our, we do our best to, to try to just be authentic and kind of show the truth as to what it is out there. And I've done, had lots of shows where I've not killed anything. 

[00:17:00] Travis Bader: You know, speaking of authentic, I, um, so a number of years ago, was it just prior to COVID? I want to say yes, um, flew in to a, in the Spazizi area with, um, my, my wife and my son were up there and there's another group ended up flying in afterwards.

[00:17:22] Travis Bader: And man, these guys came in, we came in, in a, what is it? Oh, a 182. Yeah. Cessna 182 on floats and, um, they came in on, I think four different beavers just. Oh wow. And rubbermaid toad after rubbermaid toad. And they're everything, they're a holiday. We're looking at these people like, holy crud, like they're setting up a base camp, like you wouldn't believe.

[00:17:41] Travis Bader: And, and, uh, and like they, they, these guys got everything. And then we're in a, um, a cabin, there's a group, uh, cabin on the, on the lake that we're on and talking to these people. And they all seem like they're in a kind of an off mood. I'm like, like you're in, You're in God's country in a beautiful area.

[00:17:59] Travis Bader: Like what's going on with you guys. Right. And they're talking in hushed tones and whispering amongst each other. And it's like, like, this is kind of odd. Right. And anyways, we find out the next day that they're the leader of the group, the guy who's actually a core instructor, a hunter education instructor down here, he'd forgot some essential paperwork that he's supposed to have with him.

[00:18:20] Travis Bader: And I guess they were talking about the ethical ramifications in the ins and the outs. But, but really. There, if you set your decision branching tree up in a proper way, there is no ethical ramification. There is a yes or a no. Yeah. It's just, we don't have it. We don't hunt. Right. But 

[00:18:36] Greg McHale: let's make the best of what we got.

[00:18:38] Greg McHale: Can we go fishing? I don't know. Can we go boating? I don't know. That's it. But 

[00:18:42] Travis Bader: there's that human nature to it. And eventually they got to the right conclusion and they got to the right answer. And, uh, which is, which is kudos, good stuff. But it was interesting watching that dynamic. Yeah, of course I watch your father.

[00:18:55] Travis Bader: Fly, you fly a bed and all right, we're ready. Here we go. Just got our weather window. What does he say? Oh, man. Yeah, he forgot his tags, right? 

[00:19:07] Greg McHale: Yeah, he forgot his, his hunting license and his sheep tag. 

[00:19:10] Travis Bader: Oh man. But that reality, that I thought, okay, number one, you've got your weather window. I'm trying to put myself in your head.

[00:19:21] Travis Bader: We got flown in. We're in this time. We just got it. How, how long of a flight was that for you, roughly? It was like a half 

[00:19:28] Greg McHale: an hour flight, but I had made, you know, there was four different, four different guys. So two cameramen, my dad and my son and, and then gear. So I was so like, and I, we had waited days, like the weather wasn't amazing.

[00:19:43] Greg McHale: We had put it, postponed it. And, um, yeah, so, 

[00:19:49] Travis Bader: yeah, but the, the Uh, just the realization on his face and the reality of it. And he knew, and in yours, it's like, okay, like, what do I do? Like, I get, I gotta go back. If we want to make this go through, I'm going to have to go back. Am I frustrated? Sure. Am I upset?

[00:20:04] Travis Bader: Sure. Are we family? Right. It's, and it's one of these things, sometimes we give, you Strangers, more leeway than we give our own kin, right. Just cause we're so used to uncomfortable. I think it's so common. Yeah. Like 

[00:20:17] Greg McHale: I, I, yeah, we absolutely, I do that. I do it all the time, you know, and I have to be mindful to myself, like to not do that.

[00:20:27] Greg McHale: Um, but yeah, we definitely, and I think that we didn't, um, Uh, I don't know. I'd be interested to know what your take on how, on that situation was from, from your perspective of how I dealt with it and how my dad dealt with it. 

[00:20:42] Travis Bader: Well, I thought, uh, it was, you know, it's one of these things where something goes wrong.

[00:20:47] Travis Bader: I think people should be afforded the opportunity to be upset and we should, we should constrain that upset, right? Say, okay. It's like, if I do poorly at something, I got one day to complain about it. And then tomorrow I'm off my complaining. I can't talk about it anymore. I'm on with it. I don't think, uh, bottling it up and saying nothing is an appropriate response because then it just builds resentment.

[00:21:09] Travis Bader: I thought you guys did a fantastic job of, okay, clearly there's frustration on everybody's side, clearly there's remorse on your father's side and he's thinking, oh my God, like, like I'm, I felt for him big time. I felt for you, Colter, I felt for you. I mean, you're like, okay, here we go. I'm, I'm rolling with it.

[00:21:27] Travis Bader: Right. But I thought it was dealt with really, really well. And I thought that human aspect to the, um, uh, to that possibly trying situation, because maybe you fly out and the weather window is you're not in for a bit, right. Exactly. And they're on their own. And 

[00:21:42] Greg McHale: yeah, 

[00:21:43] Travis Bader: I mean, 

[00:21:43] Greg McHale: there's always, when it, when you're dealing with aviation in the mountains, you'd never know.

[00:21:48] Greg McHale: And especially when that situation where it was, it was touch and go for getting in, uh, getting everybody in anyways. Yes. But 

[00:21:56] Travis Bader: anyway. 

[00:21:56] Greg McHale: Did he, so 

[00:21:57] Travis Bader: did he suffer a concussion off of the, uh, that fall that he took 

[00:22:00] Greg McHale: on that one? Well, I don't know with my dad, you can never really tell as he concussed one day to the next.

[00:22:06] Greg McHale: No, it's, um, I, I, I don't think so. Uh, he certainly didn't, he didn't show signs of, um, of concussion that, that evening, but, um, yeah, he, he definitely took a fall and we were like, it was a, it was so slow motion. It was like one of those ones where you, you, and, and all the adrenaline and we're pushing, we're trying to like, he takes a shot at the sheep and we got to get the sheep and everybody's, you know, got tunnel vision and I'm just looking at it at the sheep and I'm trying to figure out where to go, where it is, and I'm not watching my dad.

[00:22:45] Greg McHale: And he's, you know, it's one of those things he's from media away and he might as well be a mile away because by the time I recognize what's happening, It's just like, you're so close, but I know I just can't get you. And you just watched, you know, watch this, this old man fall head first down the hills into the rocks.

[00:23:07] Greg McHale: And it's just like, I was, I don't really know, um, what I was thinking at the time, other than this is really bad. And how bad is this? So, but it wasn't that bad. 

[00:23:21] Travis Bader: Well, it looked bad. Well, yeah, it looked, it looked bad. I don't know. He, uh, huge, huge bump on the front of his head. Looked like he had a, some cuts on the back of his head too, somehow.

[00:23:33] Greg McHale: Yeah. He had cuts in the back of his head and he had a good gash on his leg. Like a good cut on his leg. That actually was, um, that we didn't know about at all. Until we got back to, got back to camp, he never said anything about his leg. Um, so it was, it was one of those things and he suffered that was, I think, uh, at the end of it, um, that leg injury he dealt with for quite a few months after.

[00:23:58] Travis Bader: Do you think there would have been anything you could have done on them on the hillside at the time to address a leg that may have improved things later on? 

[00:24:06] Greg McHale: Yeah, like possibly, but I, I don't know. I never, I never really, I didn't know what I, even at the time. And I didn't even afterwards, I didn't know for a long time that that's what had happened.

[00:24:21] Greg McHale: Um, actually. I didn't, I didn't do a whole lot of the first first aid work, but, uh, but we're really focused on his head and more than anything. 

[00:24:30] Travis Bader: I think that's something that men particularly have a difficult time with is, okay, I'm hot, I'm hot, I'm hurt, but I'm going to suck it up and I'm going to show them how tough I am.

[00:24:40] Travis Bader: And I don't want to be a detriment to the rest of the team. And so they'll just zip up when they're having problems where they're, um, physical problems, mental problems, emotional problems, and what the. Oftentimes don't realize is the predicament, the future predicament they're putting themselves and everybody else around them in by not opening their mouth and saying, maybe I should get a bandage on this leg.

[00:25:07] Travis Bader: Maybe we should at least clean, clean it out a little bit because it's perfect punctured and got dirt in there. And I, I think it'd be. It's hugely helpful if we, if people in general, especially if you're working in a team environment, which we generally are, can normalize the, okay, I'm fine. Now I'm not fine.

[00:25:27] Travis Bader: I'm going to take steps to fix it. Just let you know, and not complain about it, but, but here we go. We're going to 

[00:25:32] Greg McHale: continue to move on, but this is where I'm at. 

[00:25:34] Travis Bader: Let the team know. 

[00:25:35] Greg McHale: Yeah. And I think that, um, you know, my father, you know, being, well, he's 70. Eight. I got like now and that he was in a, maybe it would have been 75 or something then.

[00:25:47] Greg McHale: Um, and I think that, you know, he just was trying to keep his head down and just fulfill the mission. And he hadn't had a lot of times in his life. Like, I know exactly what you're saying. Cause I came from an adventure racing background where, you know, I raced all over the world, adventure racing, and it's a team sport.

[00:26:08] Greg McHale: It's like arguably the most difficult team sport on the planet. And you, you have to have that communication. Like you have to, because the goal is the team getting across the line. It's not you. And if you don't have that communication and that, um, you know, if you don't have the ability to put your ego into the You check your ego at the door when you start on that start line, then it's going to unravel because you're going to get into a deep hole at some point that maybe you can't even climb out from and your team doesn't know what's going on.

[00:26:42] Greg McHale: And until it's too late. And when I say a deep hole, I mean, physically, mentally, just, just drained beyond, beyond where, you know, it's going to take six or eight hours maybe to get you back, uh, whether it's dehydration or situations like that. And I've lived, you know, 15 years of that racing at, uh. And doing that.

[00:27:04] Greg McHale: So like my wife has, has carried my backpack for me, like she's like other, you know, I've told teammates and like all these kinds of things. And that's how you get across the line, which is what you're talking about, which is being able to be commune, to communicate when things aren't going well. So the team can pick up the slack and help you along the way.

[00:27:25] Greg McHale: So we all get to the goal quicker. Um, I don't think my father, he, you know, he grew up in, he grew up in that, uh, That era where it's just like, you shut your mouth, you put your head down and you just keep grinding it out and you know, you suck it up just like you said. You know, I, I, I give him a lot of, and I think that that is really what gets him, gets him up mountains often.

[00:27:48] Greg McHale: Um, and that, you know, that grit that will allow him to keep coming out even. Um, uh, but sure. I think that, uh, in that situation, if he had a, Communicated a little bit better. Um, but maybe he was concussed and he wasn't even thinking about his leg. And that was the, you know, there, there, but he, I have not seen him in a situation where he had to dig real deep, like, like that before.

[00:28:15] Greg McHale: So it was a bit of a, it was, it was a, an eye opener for all of us, certainly in understanding when you're on the mountain with, you know, With, uh, with a guy that's, you know, almost 80 years old, there are different things that you have to, it's, it's, it's often like, it's like a child. It's in fact, Colter's first, first sheep hunt was with my dad and my dad was maybe 73 at the time.

[00:28:41] Greg McHale: Um, and it was easier to like, Colter was easier at seven years old than my father at, you know, 73. Yeah, I could see that. Um, So it's, you know, we, we, and nobody wants to hear it, but like I'm in my fifties, like I'm 51 right now and none of us are getting younger and the deterioration is inevitable. Um, we try to ward it off as long as we can, but you know, we are going to revert back to, back to speed at, you know, when we were children.

[00:29:17] Greg McHale: And, um, There's nothing wrong with it. It's life and embracing it and knowing it and trying to ward it off as long as you possibly can by doing all the things that are right, um, is what we, what we need to do. And, you know, so not being afraid and I, so I'm not carving up, you know, anyone who's in their seventies are certainly not my father.

[00:29:37] Greg McHale: Um, but that's just the way, the way we're, we're heading. And, um, And it is quite easy now, you know, when you get into, when you deal with, you know, you're in the mountains with, with I'm in the mountains with my dad and it is very challenging kind of to you, to what we talked about earlier on is the challenges that you have, you know, with, with videotaping and, and producing a television show with this, with this family dynamic dynamic.

[00:30:05] Greg McHale: And often, you know, that's the most difficult thing is like Greg. Checking his himself every time he goes into the mountains with and just stepping back and enjoying the moments 

[00:30:19] Travis Bader: Mm hmm 

[00:30:20] Greg McHale: like I remember the first sheep hunt with my dad and Coulter together and I just Like the cameras are there and I was just like, boys, just, just go.

[00:30:30] Greg McHale: And, and I just stood back about 200 yards. I just, I gave them, this is where we're going. We need to get up to the top of this Hill here and then we'll stop. And I just let them go. And I just stood back. I remember it so vividly. I just watched 

[00:30:47] Travis Bader: and 

[00:30:47] Greg McHale: I watched this little boy and this. You know, elderly man making their way up the mountain through the buck brush together.

[00:30:56] Greg McHale: And, and it was just like, wow, like I get choked up thinking about it because it's just like, it was one of the most amazing experiences of my hunting career. 

[00:31:05] Travis Bader: How cool is that? 

[00:31:06] Greg McHale: And, um, that's what, that's what we're, that's why I do what I do still. It's, it's because it's fun and I get, and it's another reason to help me get out and to get out in the outdoors with, uh, with my family and.

[00:31:23] Travis Bader: And you don't, you don't get that. And I, I don't find you get that in the city. I don't find you get that in the hustle and bustle. I mean, even going out to hockey games, it's, it's, you'll have your times, you'll have your moments, but you don't get that solitude And time to reflect the mental and physical exertion, where you're being pushed, you're tired, you're hungry, and you have to rely on each other for the next meal, for getting the tent set up for bedding down.

[00:31:50] Travis Bader: And man, we didn't do it properly. Now it's all blown over. Like those sorts of challenges. I find are, are what make life worth living? Uh, who was it? Michael Easter wrote a book called the comfort crisis. And he's talking about how, you know, in society, we're getting better and better at making everything comfortable.

[00:32:12] Travis Bader: You want food, you want Amazon delivering to your door, you want Uber Eats sending things over. Uh, You don't even have to leave your home. You want to interact. Okay. Interacting is really easy. I just do it on my phone. I'm done. I can put it down and I can sit here and watch everyone else living their lives.

[00:32:26] Travis Bader: I'm going to do air brackets on, for anyone who's listening and not watching, living their life, which of course is typically just their version of a life that they want to show everybody else that they're living. But you're put outside in the natural environment, you're put in these difficult situations, you're with.

[00:32:44] Travis Bader: Your nearest and dearest. I, I, you know, I, I think that level of discomfort is really what makes life worth living. 

[00:32:55] Greg McHale: I think that a lot of, a lot of city living and, and the comforts are just, you know, people just, you know, We've been accustomed to what I call life is on cruise control. 

[00:33:08] Travis Bader: And 

[00:33:09] Greg McHale: you know, when you're, you're on the highway and it's open road and you put your car on 90 or a hundred or whatever it is, and you just, you can almost just sit back and that's, that's what, that's what everyday life is for a lot of people.

[00:33:25] Greg McHale: And, and I think it's guys like for myself, I have to, I don't feel alive. Unless I'm putting myself in difficult situations and I'm challenging. And now it's, it's amazing for me. I don't feel alive unless I'm challenging my kids 

[00:33:46] Travis Bader: or 

[00:33:46] Greg McHale: even challenging my father still in his seventies, not to, not to just sit on the couch.

[00:33:52] Travis Bader: Don't let the old man in. Don't 

[00:33:53] Greg McHale: let the old man in. 

[00:33:54] Travis Bader: Right. 

[00:33:55] Greg McHale: And. And I know that he is very grateful for me pushing him. And, you know, maybe, you know, maybe my son or my daughter aren't that grateful right now for, for the, the push that they're getting. I very, I'm very confident that in the future they will look back and go, wow.

[00:34:15] Greg McHale: I like, I am where I am because life is actually really easy. Like the cruise control life is super easy. So when I do things that are hard, like it just elevates me above everybody else. And I think that like, you're, you're right. You're referencing is the, the go out, do difficult things in order to live life, to feel what life 

[00:34:39] Travis Bader: is 

[00:34:40] Greg McHale: because it can be so numbed by this, this phone, by this social media, by the, the barrage of you need to have this vehicle.

[00:34:50] Greg McHale: You need to have this house. You need to like, it's just becomes numbing. And that where I find life is in the outdoors and doing it with the people that, that, like I said, like you said, that you are dear nearest and dearest to your heart. And I get a lot of satisfaction by hearing from people that watch the show.

[00:35:13] Greg McHale: Um, that it has resonated with them and they, they understand, or they've taken the on the challenge to go out and go hiking, get into the outdoors or get in better shape because they know that it's going to elevate their life and they're going to, you know, whether they know it or not, or can articulate it, it's.

[00:35:34] Greg McHale: That they are more fulfilled in the life that they're living. 

[00:35:37] Travis Bader: And this is one of the big reasons for the Silvercore podcast. I want to be able to share people's passion for what they do on what spread positivity in a time when everyone's looking for that quick fix, whether it's, you want to be fit.

[00:35:50] Travis Bader: Here's a new, Here's a new fitness scheme that we got out here. Get your P90X or whatever it might be. You're feeling down. Well, um, microdose psilocybin, right? You want to challenge, get a, get a cold tub in the backyard. And it's all these real quick fixes that everyone's just, and it feels like. A lot of these things are just touching on the periphery and there's massive businesses in all of these peripheries.

[00:36:14] Travis Bader: Cause they offer a solution to people when the solutions actually always been there. And it's pretty simple. It's get up and go for a walk, spend 10 minutes a day. And do a little bit of exercise, something physical, something that gets your heart going. Spend 10 minutes and be mindful, be present for where you're at.

[00:36:32] Travis Bader: You don't have to do it with a group of people. If that's not your thing, he can do it all by yourself. You don't have to tell anybody about it. You don't have to post about it on, on Instagram. The solution is there. And I think people are desperate for it. I'm just hoping that by sharing stories like yours, that people are at least inspired.

[00:36:52] Travis Bader: They might not be getting the super cub and getting their license and flying out in the mountains and going to these remote areas, but it doesn't stop them from, I don't know, you want to be in an area where it's not surrounded by people, get up early and go out to your local park. Right. Yeah. Um, simple things like that.

[00:37:09] Greg McHale: Like, like we've known the answers, the answers, the answers have been there for a long, long time. Um, it's physical activity and food. Like it's, like if you just, if you changed those things in your life, if you, if you changed, started eating better. And got minimal amount of physical activity, like 20, 20 minutes a day, five days a week, that would, that could, that would be plenty as like, as long as you elevate your heart rate, you sweat and you actually move your body, not just go through the motions.

[00:37:43] Greg McHale: So you just, that's, and it's so minimal. You do those things and your life would absolutely change. Like, I know, like, I know. I know how much better I feel when I'm physically fit now, and physical fitness is different for everybody, depending on where they were, you know, you know, where they are along that journey when I'm physically fit, my brain works better.

[00:38:11] Greg McHale: I'm a nicer person to be around. I'm. Um, I'm more mindful. I, I think more deeply about things and some of that has come with age as well, but, um, certainly I think that I'm, I'm a far better parent because I'm not frustrated as easily. I'm not, um, I'm not frustrated with myself cause when I'm out of shape, it's really me beating, beating up me in the brain, into my brain and I, and then I.

[00:38:39] Greg McHale: Project that out to everybody else 

[00:38:41] Travis Bader: and it's cyclical. 

[00:38:42] Greg McHale: Yeah, it's, it's that, it's that cycle that you can't, that you have to break that the way to break it is just eat good and move your body and then life just gets so easy. 

[00:38:55] Travis Bader: And you just put the program in and press repeat day by day. Um, and it doesn't, it doesn't take a whole ton.

[00:39:02] Travis Bader: It doesn't, but the little bits every single day do add up, but that comes into routine and building that routine. And you mentioned something just recently about the importance of routine in your life. I think you posted it on social media. And I think you're saying, you know, I'd recognize I was getting out of my routine and I can find myself getting irritable.

[00:39:23] Travis Bader: And can you tell me about that? 

[00:39:26] Greg McHale: Yeah. So I'm, I've, what I've learned about myself over the years is, and I think that this is, this is people, this is humanity is we are creatures of habit. And the habits that, that we can create good habits or we can create bad habits. And we, our body, generally speaking in our mind wants to go to what we, what, because we don't like change either.

[00:39:49] Greg McHale: So when you create good habits and you get out. You get out of those habits, your body's saying like, this isn't. Something's not right here. And I've found that, um, in this particular situation is I've been traveling a lot. And when I, when I travel a lot, like to, to hockey tournaments is like the kids are, or it's, it's so much about them right now at this time in their life.

[00:40:16] Greg McHale: And so when I go out to a hockey tournament, I don't have my gym at home. I don't have these things that I, that I just, I get up at five, four 30 in the morning, five o'clock in the morning. And this is what I do. And before the rest of the world wakes up, I've already done everything that I need to do for me.

[00:40:36] Greg McHale: So when I'm out of that routine, And I not, I need to get to the arena at 7 30 and I'm in a hotel and the food is crap. And I haven't, you know, I haven't done the work to go and get the food, to put it in the proper food, to put it in the hotel. And now I'm beating myself up because, Oh, Greg, you were too lazy to go shopping last night after he got off the plane to go get the proper food.

[00:41:01] Greg McHale: To eat right this morning to get up and then exercise you didn't have, you didn't make it a priority and that's when I don't do that, I'm out of sorts and everyone around me suffers for it and recognizing that, um, Is important so that I, you know, like this morning, like I'm away from my routine and, uh, we got, we got in last night, a little bit later, um, by the time we got back to the, to where we're staying, got, but I did, you know, it's like, I got up this morning, I exercised, I got my 40 minutes in, I did stairs for 40 minutes, um, you know, and then, but when I don't do that, And now I feel good, right?

[00:41:49] Greg McHale: Like I feel good. I'm, I'm, I'm here. I'm present. Um, and, and I won't let that happen tomorrow because I know that the pattern that I've gotten into is not good for me. So really it is about understanding. Um, who you are understanding your body and getting into those, like those repetition day after day of, this is what I do.

[00:42:15] Greg McHale: Like I identify myself as somebody that works out. So when I don't work out, well, I'm not being true to who I believe that I am. 

[00:42:24] Travis Bader: Okay. Yeah. 

[00:42:25] Greg McHale: So therefore I beat myself up. And once we identify ourselves as something as like, I'm a. My son, I'm a hockey player. This is what I do. I shoot pucks in the morning. I stick handle in the morning before school I you know, I'm a runner.

[00:42:43] Greg McHale: I do all of these things and then I've culminates in how I play hockey I identify as as a hunter or whatever it is that you identify as but for me when I'm not Working out when I'm I just I know that I'm not being true to who I am and therefore I don't feel good about myself and everyone pays for it and I think that when we think deeply about who we are and what it is that we want to want to be or, and the thing, and then you just think about the things that That you need to do to become the person that you want to be like if you would like to be a runner and you're 240 pounds and you go, you know what you can be But you have to decide and you have to put in place the the steps that will get you to that place 

[00:43:37] Travis Bader: And you might not be a gold medal winning runner, but you'll still be a runner.

[00:43:43] Greg McHale: Yeah, exactly. It's, it's, it's not hard, but it's, but life, the, the way that we live life right now, the, the addiction to the cell phone, the addiction to social media, these, these things take up so much of our energy and our bandwidth and they, they hack our brains to, Almost take away that drive to really go for something.

[00:44:14] Greg McHale: And I think that that is, is such a huge thing in society right now that we, that really needs to be addressed and talked about. And like, I have conversations with the kids and like, guys, You're, you, when you live in this house, you are not having a cell phone. Your brain is not developed, fully developed till they say around 25 years old.

[00:44:38] Greg McHale: That's what I've read. Yes. So think about, think about a 12 year old or a 10 year old with a cell phone. And the impact that that has on us as adults 

[00:44:49] Travis Bader: and the unfettered access to information galore, despite whatever restrictions you want to put on a phone, there's always ways around them. 

[00:44:56] Greg McHale: And I'm sorry that I'm, I'm jumping around, but this is one of those things that like it comes to habitual back to habits.

[00:45:04] Greg McHale: And to, to bring it back and the habit of not having a cell phone is just going to be what our kids are in that have in our family. They, they will grow up without having a cell phone or social media. You can't protect them from it. You can't like, it's going to be out there and they're going to, and our, our philosophy within our house is that what value is adding to their life, especially, you know, little, Like little girls and little boys, what value is that actually adding to their life?

[00:45:37] Greg McHale: Why don't we just go outside and play well and make that a habit. 

[00:45:42] Travis Bader: And I agree with that a hundred percent, but here's the part that's going to be, uh, the difficult dichotomy is by the very nature of being a media company and having your own show and trying to get up in front of people's eyes and promote that message.

[00:45:58] Travis Bader: If all the eyes are on social media, there's time that you're going to have to spend, or you're going to have to have a team of people who are assisting you, who spend to help promote these things. Correct. How do you, how do you balance that? Great question. So 

[00:46:12] Greg McHale: I try to, um, this is, I use social media for really two purposes, one, or, or any of the media that I, That I consume one is for, um, education and the other is for inspiration.

[00:46:29] Greg McHale: Um, if, you know, if I can be entertained during one of those two, two things, then whatever, excellent. Then that's, that's just a great byproduct. Um, so I spend most of my time. Uh, consuming content that is educational. Um, whether it's, you know, business, uh, education, whether it's, um, my next goal that I'm going after, how to, uh, gathering information to make me more efficient, make me better.

[00:47:00] Greg McHale: Um, that's my, my main driver and the, uh, and, and with the other one, you know, that's the, that's the education component. And then I take, uh, inspiration. So I look for. Look for, you know, quality podcasts, you know, that, that can teach me something that can inspire me. Some of the guys that you've had on your podcast, like they're inspiring there and, and women, very inspiring people.

[00:47:28] Greg McHale: And so that's what I, I really try to, um, and which also falls in the, the education component, um, most of the time. So if I can, As a media company can portray that I inspire somebody to get out there and get off the couch, you know, or take their family out hunting, or even just go out hunting the amount of men that have, you know, dm me.

[00:47:56] Greg McHale: I never grew up in a hunting family, but now I go out and, you know, I really want to learn how to hunt. Where do I go? Like, those are the kinds of things that I, I, I love to hear. So if I can inspire somebody and then provide some education on to how to go about doing these things, whether it's somebody that reaches out to me on, uh, on.

[00:48:16] Greg McHale: And I have to take the time to, to respond back to them, you know, as best I possibly can and give them that information. That's where I. I feel a comfortable place with social media and where I fit into the, to the world. Um, I like, I, it's interesting. I watch the kids and they're watching YouTube and I'm, I'm watching, you know, seeing what they're consuming and, um, Um, probably the world's, one of the world's best marketers out there right now is, is the guy called Mr.

[00:48:50] Greg McHale: Beast and, and I look at that as straight garbage. Okay. Um, because it's, it's, it's just straight up entertainment. Sure. Um, it's not educating. Um, It's, and it's not in, it's not inspiring, um, to me, like, it doesn't inspire me to, you know, want to start a YouTube channel and, you know, and just try to grow followers because I'm giving money away or whatever.

[00:49:21] Greg McHale: So that's the kind of content that, um, that is not inspiring to me and is not educational to me. And unfortunately, I think that that's what the world is being bombarded with. And these YouTubers that are, are all out there trying to like, Literally there's courses now from what I understand at schools on how to become a YouTuber 

[00:49:44] Travis Bader: and how to create virality, how to create a sticky points, how to hack the brain, how to use human psychology to have people addicted to whatever new platform you're going to be putting out.

[00:49:56] Greg McHale: To have them sit in the chair and be sedentary and just watch a video. And consume your content at what, and so that you can sell them more product. So where is the value in that? 

[00:50:13] Travis Bader: There is no value in that for the end user. What do they get for the person putting it out? They have money and that's the driver, but that human connection is going to be lost.

[00:50:24] Greg McHale: So I want to, uh, to go a little bit deeper into, um, into your question. Um, and cause I think that if I was going to ask. If I was gonna think deeply about why I do this, and well, people would say, well, Greg, you have sponsors and you know, you're pedaling, you know, their products and you know, and, um, that's certainly, that is the business side of this.

[00:50:48] Greg McHale: Sure. For, for sure. And the one thing about that is that, um, I do have, I do have great partnerships and I've got great sponsors and I've been very fortunate to be able to build a company that, um. That has companies that want to be involved with me. Um, but the one thing about that is I don't, I try to be cognizant about, you know, being salesy.

[00:51:16] Greg McHale: I was never, I don't believe I was born to be a salesman. So the products that I do use. I know work and that's like, I, I am not a, a NASCAR, like I, I have very few partners because, because I am very picky about who I will partner with because your product has got to work because someone like you, if you're going out in the field and you, and you're I want you to be able to say, you know what, it works for Greg in the Yukon and in the mountains.

[00:51:52] Greg McHale: So it's probably going to work for me. And that's, that's the most important thing to me is again, it comes down to authenticity. And that's where, you know, the, the whole media company, um, kind of to circle back Travis's, I have to be true to who I am across every spectrum of my life. 

[00:52:16] Travis Bader: Hmm. 

[00:52:17] Greg McHale: And I feel confident that I can say that the products that I represent are quality products and that are going, they're not going to fail you, um, when you need them the most.

[00:52:29] Greg McHale: And then, additionally, my company and the Greg McHale's Wild Yukon product, I want you to be able to walk away from it and go, you know what, he taught me something today, or he inspired me to do something today. To, to do something today, that's my goal. 

[00:52:45] Travis Bader: I 

[00:52:45] Greg McHale: think 

[00:52:45] Travis Bader: for a business that's associating itself with you, if you can highlight that inspiration, the sales will be a natural by product of it.

[00:52:55] Travis Bader: If you try to sell the item or the object, people are so tired of being sold. They want to feel what you're feeling. They want to be outside. They want to be closer to nature or have that sort of connection. And, and if. The kit and gear that you're using could help them get out there in a more comfortable way.

[00:53:13] Travis Bader: I think that's. I think that's where the sales happen. I, I, I honestly believe that, um, the way that the partnerships with, uh, people who would be like yourself, I'm not, some people hate the term, but an influencer is social media influencer. And I think the only reason that, that influencers are here or it's ever became a, a, a term is because we're so inundated.

[00:53:39] Travis Bader: With so much information that if they can find somebody who they trust, who seems to be doing things right, uh, and that person's using certain equipment or kit, I don't have to think about all the different things that are out there. I'll say, okay, that works. Right. So you're essentially an information Concierge, and you're taking all of this information that's out there and distilling it down and making a more simple decision for somebody else in the end run.

[00:54:04] Travis Bader: So I don't know a different way to look at the, uh, how, how the two can work together because they're both necessary. You need money to get out in the mountain. Yeah. People need gear to get out there might not always be the most expensive gear, but that could be aspirational, um, to essentially simplify somebody, their decision process and buying kit.

[00:54:28] Travis Bader: The second that you do something that's not true to you, all credibility is gone. Yeah. Sponsors are at the door and so are the viewers. Probably. 

[00:54:36] Greg McHale: Yeah. 

[00:54:38] Travis Bader: You, you've got a background. So we're talked a little bit off air prior to getting into this adventure of, uh, having filmed hunts out in the wild. You were an RCMP officer.

[00:54:50] Travis Bader: Yeah. We've had a number of RCMP on here, both Curt serving and, and X and police officers. There's a common thread that we find. And, you know, I come from a family, father and grandfather were law enforcement. And how long were you RCMP for? 

[00:55:05] Greg McHale: I spent about, uh, eight years with the RCMP. Um, then I moved over to, to a, uh, drug surveillance unit with, uh, the Yukon government.

[00:55:18] Greg McHale: So yeah, somewhere around there is, uh, about in the, in enforcement world around, uh, eight, uh, nine, nine years, somewhere around there. 

[00:55:27] Travis Bader: Some people work their whole life looking for that cushy government gig, where they're going to have that pension at the end. But you didn't. 

[00:55:33] Greg McHale: Well, I, I mean, I, it's interesting that I think that I, I grew up in complete middle class farm country and my father was a police officer, uh, part time, uh, he worked for the government, uh, as well.

[00:55:51] Greg McHale: My mother was a nurse. So it kind of, you're, you know, you're, Just your typical middle class family. And that's all I knew. Um, there was no business. There was no, uh, you know, you go to, you go to high school, you maybe go to college. Maybe my family never, I was the first one in my family to go to university after college.

[00:56:16] Greg McHale: Um, and then, but then you go and you get a good government job and you know, you get your white picket fence and your pension after. 30 years and, you know, you sail off into retirement. And that's just how I was raised to think that that's, was the way the, the best way to navigate through the world. Um, and I think that, I was fighting that through college and through university.

[00:56:47] Greg McHale: Um, I moved away from home after like my girlfriend and I, uh, wife now, uh, Colter's mom, Denise, um, we, we left university and moved out West to the Yukon and, um, and I was fighting. That, but I'd had no direction as to, I just still knew that that's what I had to do. That was the right way to make, make a living.

[00:57:15] Greg McHale: And I went and, uh, joined the RC, joined the RCMP. Um, like I said, I did, uh, you know, eight, uh, in the enforcement, eight to 10 years there, and it was, it was great. I, I loved, um, I. I loved the camaraderie. I loved the team. Uh, I loved getting out on a Friday night and rockin and rollin and, you know, shits happenin and, and, you know.

[00:57:41] Greg McHale: You know, anyone in the enforcement world knows what I'm talking about without, you know, without saying a whole lot more you're like, you're Friday night and it's, it's that 5 percent and it's the adrenaline's pumping and, and you're getting a guy like me is getting the fix that I need. Um, and then the 95%.

[00:58:04] Greg McHale: Kicks in and that 95 percent is the paperwork, the bureaucracy, the, just the system. And I knew that there was no way that this is how I could continue to go through my life. It was, it was great. It set it. I was really good at saving money. Um, my wife and I are really good, uh, at saving money and kind of starting to understand finances and in the young age.

[00:58:33] Greg McHale: So. You know, we did some good investments and, um, some real estate and stuff like that. I was Uh, I, so I used that foundation to save money and to educate myself during that time, um, to feel good enough about, you know what, I don't need this job. They, you know, and I wanted to move into the world of, uh, adventure racing professionally.

[00:59:01] Greg McHale: And, um, there was really no appetite within the RCMP to be, um, You know, to, to be compromising on my need to be a professional athlete and to see what I could do in that world. Um, so. You know, the line was kind of, the line was kind of drawn. And, um, I had just said, well, if you're not interested in, you know, working with me, the system is the system is the way the system is.

[00:59:31] Travis Bader: Yeah, it is. And, and I think every other RCMP officer, every other RCMP officer I've ever talked to is echoed essentially the exact same thing. Yeah. 

[00:59:42] Greg McHale: Um, so at the end of it, I had to make a decision and, uh, the decision was to, to quit and to follow my dream. 

[00:59:51] Travis Bader: Was that a slow burn or was that a switch? Was there like a light switch?

[00:59:54] Travis Bader: It 

[00:59:54] Greg McHale: was a slow burn because, uh, like I could go into the details on it, but I brought a number of people. Into the organized back who had already quit back into the organization to work part time. Like there was a, there was a mechanism there that I was trying to work where I could work part time and help, you know, and at the end of the day, it, um, the bureaucracy is, is thick and it's, uh, and that, and I think that I'm, I'm I'm thankful now.

[01:00:25] Greg McHale: I was actually thankful right away that there was no mechanism for them to say, yeah, you know what, you can work part time or you can take a leave of absence and then come back because, well, I would have never come back, but at the same, probably, but at the same time, I'm glad that there, that was never an option.

[01:00:42] Greg McHale: Right? Like I could have come back years later. Of course I could have re engaged, but. Um, I needed to make that, I needed to cut that off, but that did take a period of time. 

[01:00:52] Travis Bader: Was that a scary decision? 

[01:00:54] Greg McHale: Um, yeah, of course it was a scary decision because, you know, the, the money was, the money was fine and we had, you know, used that to, we had saved and done other things, but.

[01:01:06] Greg McHale: It wasn't, it wasn't scary to me because I knew that I had to be true to me at the end of the day, I had to be just like, this is not going to work. I do not, I will not climb the ranks. I knew that my personality is not such that, that I was going to, um, to do what is required to climb the ranks within the system.

[01:01:31] Greg McHale: And when I knew that it was like, well, this is not the, this is not the world for me. I need goals and I need things to achieve and I need to have something to, that I can go and get and nobody can stop me. There's no roadblocks to what Greg McHale can do both in that system. There's that there are roadblocks and, and, you know, without, without carving up the RCMP, I'm just, I'm, it's more just, it's the way the government is run.

[01:02:03] Greg McHale: Sure. And I knew that I did not fit into that government 

[01:02:09] Travis Bader: system. Sure. Some people do this. Some people fit in quite well. Yeah. More power to them. Yeah. Um, some people identify themselves so closely with their job. That's, that's a, It's essentially an existential crisis when they leave. 

[01:02:23] Greg McHale: That is a very interesting thing.

[01:02:25] Greg McHale: Cause I, especially within the RCMP, the prevalence of that mindset and they ingrain that in you as well. 

[01:02:32] Travis Bader: That's right. Like 

[01:02:33] Greg McHale: that's the whole point. Depot six months is you are ingrained within the system to believe that you're the best. Sure. Like, and that's what, that's what. And that's what they want. And there's nothing, there's nothing wrong with that because you want to have people who are confident out there and be able to make decisions and all of those things.

[01:02:50] Greg McHale: But that was the one thing about me is I never identified myself as a police officer. Like, like, you know, when I referenced, well, I identify myself as an athlete or as, you know, somebody that works out every day. I never identified myself as a police officer, where a lot of my coworkers were always like, well, this is who I am.

[01:03:10] Greg McHale: Right. And. That was never me. So I think that it was important, you know, for me to be able to, to move on. And I knew that I was inevitably going to move on. I think in the back of my heart and, you know, I knew that I was, this was not going to be for me forever. 

[01:03:27] Travis Bader: It's funny. You talk about how it's ingrained in you.

[01:03:30] Travis Bader: The one joke I heard over and over again, as a kid growing up from other municipal cops was, well, it was going to be RCMP, but I didn't want the lobotomy, right? They, the same joke over and over again, right? Didn't want the lobotomy to give you a depo. Uh, but, but they do, they ingrain that into you and for good reason at certain times, and maybe times are changing.

[01:03:50] Travis Bader: Um, I'm sure there are things that you've learned from that experience. From your time there, whether positive things you've learned on ways to do things or ways to maybe do things differently. What have you learned from that? 

[01:04:05] Greg McHale: Well, I think that my experience with, um, with see for me, Regina and Depot was, it was super easy.

[01:04:17] Greg McHale: Um, the, the best thing that I liked That I've brought from the RCMP and was really the comradery 

[01:04:27] Travis Bader: Yeah. 

[01:04:27] Greg McHale: Is the knowledge that I'm a team player. Like I, I, at my core, I'm a team player. 

[01:04:33] Travis Bader: Mm. 

[01:04:33] Greg McHale: Um, but I just require a really high level team. 

[01:04:36] Travis Bader: Mm. 

[01:04:37] Greg McHale: To be, to be ha to be happy. Sure. And, and the RCMP. Um, and, uh, this, I, I just, I don't want this to be a slag on the RCMP because I really, I like the organization and I have a lot of good friends Yep.

[01:04:52] Greg McHale: That are in the organization. Um. More than anything, it just wasn't for me. So that's what, um, you know, going through that process and, and seeing how depo is, is run and how the, um, and the people that, you know, the people that are, that I thought policing was, or the kind of person, the kind of, that should be a police officer is, is changing and it's changing.

[01:05:23] Greg McHale: And I've been out for a long time. And it was changing then, so I can't even imagine what it is now, but, um, I think that if I was, I probably would have done far better in the military in more of a, um, uh, an operations unit. I think that my mindset would be certainly more, and that's why I did great in, uh, adventure racing.

[01:05:46] Greg McHale: Mm hmm. Uh, because it's, it's The, you know, it's so challenging and the team that you're on all have to be high level and um, and I raced it on some of the best teams in the world. So it was, that's where I, I think I, without ever being been, I've never been on a, um, you know, one of those, one of those military teams, but I think that there, I can draw a lot of similarities probably to the, the mindset of the individuals that are on them and the amount of the work ethic that has to be there.

[01:06:21] Greg McHale: Has to go into maintaining those positions and being able to do what they do. 

[01:06:26] Travis Bader: I'd say so, you know, there's a podcast, it'll be released. Well, it'll be, we're talking now, it's going to be released in the future, but by the time everyone listens to this one, it's already going to be released. And that's with Craig Weller.

[01:06:37] Travis Bader: And he's got a book out called building the elite and he, um, approaches it from a very analytical aspect. He approaches the idea of building special Operators and elite soldiers and, uh, their graduates in, in courses that have a up to 90 percent dropout rate, they have their graduates of their programs that they have, they have a 90 percent success rate going through buds or going through different, uh, uh, different units, but that elite.

[01:07:11] Travis Bader: Soldier and the elite operator is going to be looking at their mental aspects or emotional aspects or physical aspects, the food they take in the, uh, the information they consume and everything you've talked about here so far would lead me to believe that you are predisposed to be one of those individuals who would do well in an environment like that.

[01:07:34] Travis Bader: Now, one of the reasons I was asking about the depot and your CMP and sort of, you know, Uh, the training programs is cause that gives you some background into how, how people build other people up, how people can, uh, influence others to, uh, achieve goals in a certain area, different training programs. And something that I've talked about with Gladys, as well as with, uh, you off offline here is about building stronger future generations, as well as, you know, allowing men to be men, a couple of things that are Close to your heart.

[01:08:13] Travis Bader: What are your thoughts on that? 

[01:08:16] Greg McHale: Yeah, I, I think it goes, you know, it's really, it's the culmination of where society is going in my perception and the need for strong male influences out there in a time where, um, you know, not to, not is that masculinity is a problem for a lot of, a lot of people, right? And because they, It references connotations of, you know, aggressiveness and, you know, and, and that's, that seems to be that that nowadays is a problem 

[01:08:57] Travis Bader: and 

[01:08:59] Greg McHale: it's not a problem.

[01:09:00] Greg McHale: It's, it's what, it's what we need to be able to control, um. What's like the stuff that's happening happening now like the not to get too too far down there Because I want to be very articulate and I don't want to come across um as either placating to to anyone or not, um, not saying exactly what I mean my point is that I take a lot of pride and a lot, I put a lot of energy into trying to build, um, to focusing on my, both my son and my daughter, um, making, making sure that, that to, about my daughter is that she has a very positive feminine woman in her life and there's nothing wrong with 

[01:09:52] Travis Bader: femininity.

[01:09:53] Greg McHale: And equally, there is nothing wrong with 

[01:09:57] Travis Bader: masculinity. 

[01:09:58] Greg McHale: And I think that what's happening is women are feeling like they are the, whether it's the, the movement that started in the sixties, that women have to be strong and now they're becoming more masculine and more there and strong women is amazing. Like, that's what we want.

[01:10:19] Greg McHale: We want strong households, which requires strong women and requires strong men. And, but we also don't want to lose femininity and we don't want to lose masculinity. And that's where I think the lines are getting so blurred right now, where little boys are not, you know, not, they can't go outside and they can't rough house and they can't be little boys.

[01:10:46] Greg McHale: They can't, they're not allowed to. You know, utilize or express those masculine tendencies that we have by nature and little girls are being taught to you've got to be strong and you've got to go out there and you've got to, you know, work in the man's world and you have to, you know, climb the corporate ladder, which is fine too.

[01:11:07] Travis Bader: You know how many women are disillusioned and unhappy because they've been fed this idea that so many women that I talk to, and maybe it's the women that I hang around with, we talk about, you know, aggressive women. Well, there's a difference between assertive and aggressive people get these things kind of mixed up.

[01:11:24] Travis Bader: No, they're strong and they're assertive. Doesn't mean that they're aggressive. Um, and. Talking to women who are raised to climb that ladder, to try and compete in a quote unquote man's world, when that was never the goal, they're strong in their own right and much stronger than men in certain places. And men are much stronger than women in certain areas and be able to rely on each other's strengths back and forth.

[01:11:51] Travis Bader: And I think that's where the, um, Uh, some of the difficulty has come in is because people will talk about the, uh, the patriarchy and the, uh, uh, how, how we have to overcome this. And we, in order to overcome that women have to become the men and men have to tone it down. They got to be more like the women.

[01:12:12] Travis Bader: Our education system was built like that for, for, well, still is it's a, it's a very female dominated, uh, uh, industry. 

[01:12:21] Greg McHale: The, I think the, the idealism of, uh, Equality is at the root of a lot of, uh, a lot of this and is, uh, is the problem, um, you know, the, the famous, like George Orwell, you know, you know, the, the line in, uh, animal farm, you know, all pigs are created equal.

[01:12:44] Greg McHale: Some pigs are just more equal than others, right? Okay. It's that is, that is the world, the way the world is. And it's not possible to, to change that. And with the understanding that men and women are not equal on all, on all spectrums. Right. And they shouldn't be. They shouldn't be right. We shouldn't expect them to be like, Take a look at our differences and, and embrace them and be happy that they're there because what are we trying to build this androgynous society of, you know, of everyone's the same and everyone is treated equal and it's not.

[01:13:24] Greg McHale: It will never happen. It is not nature. And that's what, that's what I think that we're, we're really struggling with right now. And my job, I literally feel like it's my job to make sure that my children and the people that listen to me, or that derive some sort of value from what I have to say that they, They will think a little bit more deeply about what it is that they're doing with their children or themselves.

[01:13:57] Greg McHale: Like you can't go out and eat fast food and think that you're going to be in shape or think that you're going to live a long time. You, you can't, you can't suppress a little boy's nature, natural tendencies to go out and explore, to go out into the wilderness in the backwoods. In the backyard, like, like we literally live in the wilderness and my kids run around the neighborhood.

[01:14:25] Greg McHale: We're all like, there's, we have a neighborhood that there's three acres. Everyone's got kind of three acres and it's just a little, little neighborhood. Sure. And. The kids can be gone for, for hours at their age now. And I don't know where they are, but I know that they're going to come home. They know how to get home because we've taught them the skills, you know, whether it's okay, it's evening, the sun is setting in the West and you need to go through the bush this way.

[01:14:49] Greg McHale: You're going to hit it, probably hit a trail. And 

[01:14:51] Travis Bader: like, 

[01:14:51] Greg McHale: they're going to make their way, their way home. And we don't confine them and helicopter them because they need to get out and express themselves. They need to make mistakes. They need to fall down, pick themselves up, and they need to be able to go, okay, that hurt, that sucked.

[01:15:10] Greg McHale: Doc going to do that again versus mom and dad going, Oh, Johnny, are you okay? Don't play on those monkey bars, you know, like eighth place trophies. Like it's, 

[01:15:21] Travis Bader: you need regulated risk. 

[01:15:23] Greg McHale: You need regulated risk is a, is a, is a perfect way. And I think that, um, One of the stories that, that I is so impactful that I worked with a, with, uh, a man, he was 83 years old and I was 23.

[01:15:41] Greg McHale: And I took, um, a job in, uh, in an outfit Northwest territories, as far out there as you can get. Um, and he, his name was Alex Van Bibber. He grew up on the Yukon on, no, he grew up, um, On the Takini river, which feeds into the Yukon river, just north of white, white horse. And then that river flows into Alaska, um, past Dawson city.

[01:16:13] Greg McHale: So basically this man at 14 years old, he was, and I say, man, at 

[01:16:21] Travis Bader: 14 years 

[01:16:21] Greg McHale: old, because he was in charge of his younger siblings to get on a raft. And he was, and I say, man, at 14 years old, because he was in charge of his younger siblings to get on a raft. And with his three younger siblings, and they would raft down the Tikini River, down the Yukon River to Dawson City, which is 700 kilometers away.

[01:16:42] Greg McHale: 14 years old, three younger siblings, and his job was to get them to To school. So they had to leave home and they were, they were going to the school in Dawson city, which was the capital of the Yukon at the time. 

[01:16:57] Travis Bader: And 

[01:16:58] Greg McHale: that young man at 14 years old had the capability to get his, his younger siblings to the destination.

[01:17:10] Greg McHale: So if we can, if we could do that. Back, you know, 80 years ago, like what, think about how, what we've done to our children now and think about the capacity of the average 

[01:17:26] Travis Bader: kid. Huge. It's massive. What I mean, look at Colter, he's carrying the rifle, the backpack. I think you're what, seven years old at the time, eight years old when you're in that, uh, on the, uh, the sheep hunt.

[01:17:39] Travis Bader: Um, I think you're carrying grandpa's backpack up there. Um, It, we don't give, people don't tend to give kids the credits that they deserve. And I remember being a kid and thinking like, these stupid adults, I can't believe it. I'm getting away with this again. They're like, Oh, he's just a kid. He doesn't know what he's doing.

[01:18:00] Travis Bader: I'm like, Oh, wow. I totally, now I might not have known the ins and outs and the, all the reasons behind, but I would know what I was doing. Um, and I, and I carry that forward, you know, with my own kids as well. I maybe sometimes overly anticipate that they know what's going on and they're fully capable and they can do things.

[01:18:20] Travis Bader: And I'd rather see them go out and fail in a controlled way, in a way where they're not going to hurt themselves too badly. And it's not going to be too catastrophic and start normalizing these failures so that they can actually start pushing further. And you mentioned, you know, about, uh, guys, young boys having a strong male role model.

[01:18:42] Travis Bader: From my observations, kids are born, dad's needed for nothing. Mom's the one that everyone needs, right? Mom takes care of everything. And mom, mom's the one in for the kids. But when, when the kids get older, the boys need a strong male role model to show them. What a man should be like, and women need a strong male role model to show them what to expect in a husband.

[01:19:10] Greg McHale: Exactly. 

[01:19:11] Travis Bader: And I think that's just, that's a part of the puzzle, which has been kind of stepped on in recent years by people who are, you know, Uh, don't know how to differentiate the difference between assertiveness and aggressiveness, because they've lived in either a helicopter or the lawnmower world, where the parent gets out in front and mows down all the problems right before they even pop up.

[01:19:35] Travis Bader: And they don't know how to deal with these difficulties or these challenges and they're, um, insecure. In a nutshell, and they view other people who are assertive or strong or doing something in a more brazen way as a threat. And how do we eliminate these threats? I need my safe space, safe space. I want these threats gone.

[01:19:57] Travis Bader: And we're just now seeing, uh, The repercussions of that. And there's, there is a pushback that's happening. 

[01:20:02] Greg McHale: Yeah. And that's, and that's fantastic. That pushback is, is so needed. And, and you know, the pendulum swings so far one way, and then guys like us step up and go, okay, enough is enough. Like we're this, this has to end.

[01:20:16] Greg McHale: We must speak up because like, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not an activist. Sure. Like, that's not my nature. Like I need to get pushed. Like I'm going to, I'm going to move toward my goals methodically, and it's, I'm going to, I'm going to get what I want, but I don't really, um, I don't feel comfortable being that activist and, you know, having the, this is the purpose, but when it, that pendulum swings so far, like, and you wake up guys like you and I, uh, to the realization that this is not the best thing for society, then, Then you become the activist, you take on that role because that's what strong men do.

[01:21:00] Greg McHale: We step up when the time is, when, when it is needed and no matter what the circumstance. Um, and that's where, uh, I don't really have a choice. And like, I mean, you, you're doing this podcast and you're having these conversations because it's important because society, because it's the best thing for society.

[01:21:21] Greg McHale: And when you know better, you do better. And that's what we're, that's what we're doing right now. And that's what my, like, I feel my job is a big part of it is to create certainly a great, strong, uh, strong young man in, in, in my immediate family and a strong young woman that understands, like you said, she needs to know what a man is actually like and what the expectations of a man are.

[01:21:51] Greg McHale: But the problem right now. And it's gone so far the problem right now is that young women cannot find that strong aggressive, like aggressive is not the right word, confident, strong, confident male in society. And it's, and it's depressing because they, they maybe they've seen. They've had that role model in their life, their father, and now that guy isn't out there because, um, single, single parenting, you know, there's all kinds of social dynamics that have created this and, um, and it's getting harder and harder for, um, For as women get, you know, get stronger and more, you know, more assertive, they can't find those guys because there are very few and far between because society is dumbed, dumbed the male down to sit and watch video games and porn.

[01:22:51] Greg McHale: Like we're like, guys, we, we are, we are not, um, We are not difficult. Uh, we're , we're not difficult, you know, people generally speaking, I think we're quite simple. 

[01:23:10] Travis Bader: Simple compared to may. Maybe not as nuanced in, in certain ways. Yeah. Straightforward in, uh, in approach most often. Yeah. I, I wouldn't say simple.

[01:23:22] Travis Bader: I wouldn't say that guys are simple. 'cause if guys, they're 

[01:23:24] Greg McHale: not simple in the, in the terms of. Of, um, no, 

[01:23:28] Travis Bader: no, but, but even then there's, there's a lot of, um, I think for a long time, the guys have been played off is no, we're black and white. It's super simple, but, but we're learning that there's a lot more nuance to it as well.

[01:23:40] Travis Bader: That's kind of coming out when we have people like your father, Oh, it's simple. You know, I'll just, I'll hide it all away. I'll, I'll hide down the pain, the emotion, whatever it might be. I think we are equally as complex on both sides. We do approach. Issues in a very different way where men might want to be a problem solver and say, here's the solution.

[01:24:00] Travis Bader: I see the solution. Um, women might approach it from a different fashion where, as opposed to be solution oriented, the solution is talking it out and, and you know, the whole Mars and Venus sort of thing where everyone's coming from a different angle, but the. disillusionment that we have when we don't realize that we have differences and these differences are important and how we hone these differences so that confidence doesn't come out as arrogance.

[01:24:28] Travis Bader: So that assertiveness doesn't come out as aggressiveness and people can actually understand the difference between the two of these things. Yeah. I think that comes from example more than Being told over and over again. If they can see somebody who's, uh, strong and feminine, and they're going about their day without having to hammer them over the head, they say, well, that's the example I want to follow.

[01:24:54] Travis Bader: They see someone who's strong and masculine and they say, well, this is a role model. I look up to, I think that's. The strongest way we can do it. And you're, you're doing it from your perspective through your shows, showing how vulnerable you are with your family. I mean, there's emotion in there. You can see that, um, that doesn't mean you're less vulnerable.

[01:25:20] Greg McHale: You know, and it's, it's funny as, uh, as I get older, I get far more emotional than, than, you know, I did grow up in, you know, where you hide that and you don't, you don't talk about it. And, um, and I, I have no issue with, with, with having those conversations and being, being far more vulnerable and emotion and emotional.

[01:25:40] Greg McHale: Yeah. There's, um, I think that it is important to, to note that I'm, I'm of the same conclusion as you are in, in that you do need to have all of those things to be a well rounded human and to be, to be a good, uh, a good person that, that has empathy and that has, but can still be, um, you know, still go and have goals and be motivated and driven.

[01:26:06] Greg McHale: Um, yeah, that we, we are very, uh, I love the way you put it, Travis. We are, we are very complex, complex people. Um, uh, humans are, and men are as well, but I do think that, um, men in general, uh, because, you know, that's my go to here is, um, is we can be also be very, very Um, very simple in the fact that we don't, um, maybe think deeply or we are very impacted easily by non, um, we are not emotional by, by nature.

[01:26:44] Greg McHale: We are not as emotional as, as women by nature. And I think that we can, we can sit in front of a, like, generally speaking, men can sit in front of a TV and just, and the hours can go by. Um. Thank you. And all of a sudden, you know, you've, you're playing video games and that stimulation that is, that is provided in, in those settings that is not good for, for anybody.

[01:27:11] Greg McHale: Um, I think that we can, we may be, and this is a personal opinion, that males can be more, Um, more apt to spend their time that way than women, like, like guys will sit in front of video games or sit or be to go back to what I'm talking about, you know, is, you know, you look at the, the inundation of pornography within, within society and the, and men not interested in going out there and, um, and meeting women and having these social interactions because that, that part of their world is.

[01:27:50] Greg McHale: Is taken care of some somewhere else. And that interest that, that, you know, human nature, sexual desire is satisfied through this fake and artificial world. And now all of a sudden women aren't getting that same. Um, interaction back that they, that they need because they, they don't get that. They don't release that tension in the same way that males do.

[01:28:18] Travis Bader: See, I've read something about, um, modern men being fearful of rejection to such a point, saying the wrong thing, ending up on social media, on somebody's, uh, feed. 

[01:28:29] Greg McHale: That's a whole different world, isn't it? 

[01:28:30] Travis Bader: Right. Based on, um, On whatever it might be, maybe dating apps have made it easy to not to have to deal with rejection.

[01:28:38] Travis Bader: And I've heard that is a more underlying, uh, route because pornography has been around for, for millennia, right? Not, not like it is now. Sure. The, um, well, I don't know, you go, you go back in time to the, uh, to the ancient Greeks and Romans and the, um, the, um, the ability to handle, um, Social interactions, um, rejection and failure.

[01:29:08] Travis Bader: I think those are some pretty huge, um, barriers that people are now finding because they don't have that. You're talking about eighth place ribbons. They don't have the, okay, I ran and I lost. I came in second place. I lost. Right. Yeah. Um, they don't have. That repeated fail and then build back up, fail, then build back up.

[01:29:30] Travis Bader: It's I, I, I see that as one of the, the bigger, uh, bigger drivers, but, but I have to imagine with these views. You're going to have some polarizing opinions and you being in the public eye, um, you're probably going to get some hate, whether that be from just the fact that you're out hunting, you're going to have anti hunters.

[01:29:54] Travis Bader: Uh, the fact that you are, uh, perpetuating a more male dominated, um, uh, male energy persona, um, are you getting hate on these? Are you getting, uh, you Yeah, you know, 

[01:30:10] Greg McHale: you know, it's really, it's really interesting because, um, we have this conversation probably every six months within the team and it's kind of like, I'm surprised at the level of hate that I don't get.

[01:30:29] Greg McHale: Like I, I, I have the same opinion as you, but I think that, um, and maybe this is an algorithm thing that just people aren't seeing it. 

[01:30:39] Travis Bader: Or the echo chamber. 

[01:30:40] Greg McHale: Like, yeah, it may very well be that I am like blackballed on social media and, and, and, The only people that see my stuff are people that are like minded, um, because it's very, very seldom that I have somebody that reaches out and typically it's about, uh, it's, it's not so much my opinions, um, other than, other than hunting, hunting, it's maybe somebody sees a, me with, uh, you know, a dead animal and they, I'm, I'm just this horrific person.

[01:31:10] Greg McHale: Sure. Um, but that, you know, That's very few and far between so, so which is, um, either, either what I'm saying is resonating with, with people or some people. Or most people are just never seeing it because, because I do have dead animals in my social media, I do have firearms in my social media, I, you know, I have these things that are really not, not liberal, like, and, and I would probably say that, you know, social media platforms are very, I wouldn't, not going to say they're anti, but they're certainly not promoting The, uh, the kind of things that, that I'm saying or that I'm doing.

[01:31:58] Greg McHale: Sure. Because it's not the norm. It's not what, uh, what mainstream society wants to hear. 

[01:32:03] Travis Bader: Well, I'm going to be curious for everyone who's listened to this episode and heard the views and thoughts, what are your thoughts? In the comments, leave it out there. What's your background. Are you being, are you coming from a contrary background and you have contrary opinions or you agree with what's going on here?

[01:32:21] Travis Bader: I'd be interested what other people have to say, if everyone's chiming in and saying, I'm a hunter and you know, I, I mirror the opinions, we're all in the SACO chamber. That'd be interesting to hear too. 

[01:32:30] Greg McHale: Yeah, no, it really is. Cause I'm like, I'm a big, Uh, a big believer in, um, in education and educating myself.

[01:32:40] Greg McHale: And I don't necessarily mean formal education, you know, the, the, the education system, the university. I don't, I don't mean that. I just mean continually lifelong learning. And. I would really be interested in, in that the same question, because I want to know what it is that, you know, what am I saying that the people either agree with or disagree with and for what reason so that, so that I can go, okay, you know what, Greg, maybe you really need to think about, sit down and really think deeply about what it is that you said and why you said it and why you believe that.

[01:33:11] Greg McHale: And, um, I'm always up for. For a great debate, but also a great conversation that I can take away and reflect on. And what can I take away from that to make me better or my family better? 

[01:33:26] Travis Bader: I think that's just the epitome of always learning, but there's a guy, his Instagram handle is let me die learning.

[01:33:34] Travis Bader: He's a past guest on the, uh, the podcast here and man, I agree with that. I've got my core values. I hold them true. My North star and everything else I measure against that. Some of my opinions are I'm open to reasonable persuasion. I have ideas on things, but I'm not going to shut down somebody else who has a different approach or a different idea.

[01:33:55] Travis Bader: Yeah. At the end, I might not agree with them, but I can agree that they are justified in feeling the way they do or thinking the way they do based on their background, life experience, whatever it might be. But there's going to be just as many people out there with my background and life experience that, um, um, maybe that's where the echo chamber comes in, but I think being open to reasonable persuasion is a very important thing when, whenever having these discussions.

[01:34:21] Travis Bader: Yeah. 

[01:34:21] Greg McHale: Yeah, I think, like, even, like, I am, you know, I can be certainly, um, looked at as being very straightforward and this is, this is my belief and I'm not, uh, I'm not flexible on it, but I like to believe as I get older that I, And far more, uh, far better at being able to take somebody's, um, information and picking out the good and what works for me and what doesn't work for me, or, and then trying to, trying to find out why do you come to the conclusion that, that this is what you believe, because Maybe, maybe you're right and I'm wrong.

[01:35:00] Greg McHale: And, and I need to, and I need to reflect on that. And I need to understand the topic better. And yeah, when we stop, when we stop learning, when we stop educating and you think that you know it all, then that's, it's a scary place. 

[01:35:13] Travis Bader: Yeah. The more you learn, the more, you know, you don't know, and that's the whole Dunning Kruger thing, right?

[01:35:18] Travis Bader: You've heard of that one. 

[01:35:19] Greg McHale: No, go ahead. 

[01:35:19] Travis Bader: So two guys in the States, Dunning and Kruger, two different universities, they got together and they did this, uh, study and basically the, uh, perception of confidence, uh, perceived competence based on actual ability. And they have this massive bell curve where a person starts off, they're learning something new, they're learning something new.

[01:35:38] Travis Bader: And they know, they know nothing. All right. All of a sudden they get a little bit of information and their confidence is through the roof and they know in their head, they know everything. Yet they've only learned a little bit more. And then that slowly starts going down, down, down to a point where their perceived competency.

[01:35:55] Travis Bader: Is actually lower than what their ability is, because the more, you know, the more, you know, you don't know. And they start second guessing themselves. So you always find people at different stages in life on that Dunning Kruger where they're I'm so rock solid and I know, and they're screaming from the hilltops about their opinion and whatever it might be.

[01:36:14] Travis Bader: You get a little bit older in life and you're like, Okay. Maybe there's other ways. Maybe, maybe my approach wasn't the right one there, but you're, you're more receptive anyways. 

[01:36:23] Greg McHale: I was going to give you a great Dunning Kruger effect that I've, that in my life, um, is in the aviation world. So I, um, You know, there's, there's this, that, that bell curve, there's that Dunning Kruger effect, and it goes, it's about between 400 and 600 hours, uh, flight time is one of the, well, zero to 600 hours is the most dangerous flight time that a person can have because, and, And usually around that four to 600 is where you're going to see accidents happened as well, or somewhere in there.

[01:37:02] Greg McHale: I don't know if the numbers are a hundred percent correct, but it's, I know the 600 hours is roughly, um, and it, it was almost to clockwork for me. Like you, you get into aviation and bush flying for me and I didn't know anything. And you know, you're just, you're so afraid and you're learning everything.

[01:37:22] Greg McHale: And then you get, you know, you start to get some hours under you, you start to get the feel of the plane and yeah, yeah. Now you get around that four to 600 hours. It's like, I got this. Like now you start, start to push things and, and, uh, you know, you're You know, really ride that, ride that envelope on what a bush plane can do, where you can land your, your perception of, you know, there's so much that goes into bush flying, not to get into the nuances of it, but, um, you know, I got to that 600 mark and.

[01:37:52] Greg McHale: And it was, it was like, I got this. And that's when I had my accident. 

[01:37:57] Travis Bader: Tell me 

[01:37:57] Greg McHale: about this. Like that's when I crashed my plane. And then it, you know, it was just like, holy crap, Greg, like, you don't know what you think, you know? So then you, you go up and, and you know, that bell curve goes down and it's like, now it's like, okay, you need to be a little more, a little more careful, a little more cautious.

[01:38:18] Travis Bader: How did you crash your plane? 

[01:38:21] Greg McHale: I was up, uh, yeah, I was way up in the middle of nowhere. Like, like this, I live in Whitehorse and it was 300 miles, something like that North. And, um, I had flown, I had shuttled fuel in with my 185, my, the bigger plane on floats and to a place where I could land unload a bunch of fuel because I wanted to do some scouting in this area that I'd never been in.

[01:38:45] Greg McHale: And, um, so I flew up there by myself. Plane is loaded. I, there was this, this grassy area that I want, I thought, okay, I can land here and dump my fuel off and I can shuttle and do my scouting out of this, out of this area. So, you know, and it's important to know, like, It is remote. 

[01:39:04] Travis Bader: Like 

[01:39:05] Greg McHale: there is nobody around, but me, the bush and the animals and for, you know, hundreds of miles.

[01:39:12] Greg McHale: And I, um, I went to, to, to really, I did my flybys. I checked it out. I thought, yes, you know, this looks good. Uh, I can land here. And there was a bit of a can't in, um, in what I would call the landing area. Right. And it was grassy. So. I went to, I put wheels, wheels down and there was bushes on both sides, like just willow, like scrub brush on, on both sides.

[01:39:44] Greg McHale: And I kind of put wheels down and I didn't fully, fully care. I half ass committed and it didn't feel good. I was starting to slide off wet grass. I was starting to slide off to the left and I decided, okay, I got to get out of here. So I poured the, poured the salve to it and, and the plane. This is, this is where the thinking, you know, everything and all the mistakes come in.

[01:40:13] Greg McHale: It's not usually one thing that kills people in airplanes. It's usually a culmination of a bunch of different small mistakes which lead to, lead to the accidents. So, hottest day Of the, of the summer that I've ever flown in, it's like 27 degrees. Um, I was fully loaded, like max weight in the airplane. Um, landing on an unknown air, air strip or location.

[01:40:48] Greg McHale: And all of these things, um, Culminated in me. I, you know, putting the throttle down to it and the plane just did not respond. 

[01:40:58] Travis Bader: It's 

[01:40:58] Greg McHale: just, doesn't have enough power at that temperature. Um, it just heavy and I was just flying. 

[01:41:07] Travis Bader: What went through your head then? 

[01:41:09] Greg McHale: It was immediate. It was like, this isn't good. Like, and then now the trees are starting to, to.

[01:41:15] Greg McHale: To come at me. And there was a lake off to my left. So I was trying to land on wheels and there was this lake off to my left. And as I'm coming now, I'm now I'm no longer over top of the landing zone at all. I'm over top of bushes that are about table height. And my wheels are just, just touching the bushes, the tops of these, these bushes.

[01:41:40] Greg McHale: And which is just enough to not. You know, just slowing the plane and the trees are coming, are coming at me. There's there's sparse and I'm, I'm thinking, okay, and I'm gaining, and I get a little bit of elevation because actually where I was going to land kind of drops off. So now I'm, Off of the bushes, but I'm not gaining altitude and I'm see this one pine tree coming up and I'm right at the top and I'm thinking, okay, I can't, you know, I can't move.

[01:42:16] Greg McHale: I can't just throw the stick and get out, get out of here because I'm going too slow. I know I'm going to stall and a stall means. Basically stop flying and you nose dive into the ground. And I know that this is going to happen. If I, you know, if I, if I do anything that is, um. 

[01:42:34] Travis Bader: We're still indicators going on here.

[01:42:35] Greg McHale: No, I don't even have them. 

[01:42:37] Travis Bader: Okay. 

[01:42:37] Greg McHale: So you need to know the plane, like a super cub. There's no stall indicators. There is just, it's a field thing. Okay. And I know that if. If, if I quickly, you know, try to turn left here, um, I'm going to stall this plane. And so I'm just easing the wings up and I'm see this tree coming.

[01:42:57] Greg McHale: And I think I'm going to miss this tree. And I think if I miss this tree, I can then just glide over to the lake, get into ground effect and I'll be good. And I'll get out of there. I I'm coming up on the tree. I turned the wings slightly. And I think, okay, the wing is over top of it. The chop of this tree hits the, hits the, uh, L or the, uh, aileron and, um, or the spar on the wing and hits, hits it.

[01:43:26] Greg McHale: And it's just enough to slow me down. It, you know, it's only the top foot of this tree, 

[01:43:31] Travis Bader: but 

[01:43:31] Greg McHale: it's enough to slow me down. I'm going to the lake and. I'm losing elevation and there's nothing, there's nothing I can do about it. And I try to just put it down on the edge of the, on the side of the lake. Well, I didn't even get to the lake is the swamp.

[01:43:47] Greg McHale: And I'm just going, okay, well we're going in, we're going in flat straight at least. So I go in and I crashed the plane and the wing digs in and you know, it's up on its side, the wing is bent and, and um, I was 

[01:44:01] Travis Bader: like, 

[01:44:02] Greg McHale: wow, I was, you know, I was fine. The good thing about those planes are that they do fly so slow that it's a super cub is, you know, one of the, is very forgiving that way that you can slow them down so much that, um, you know, the worst thing would have been as a, is if I had a stalled it, cause it would have been a nose dive into the ground.

[01:44:24] Greg McHale: And you probably, you don't walk away from those ones typically. So 

[01:44:28] Travis Bader: yeah. How did you get out of that one? 

[01:44:30] Greg McHale: Um, I had a, uh, I think I had an inReach at the time and, um, I hit the, I know I had an inReach and I had a sat phone as well. So I was able to call my, my wife on the sat phone and, um, give, give her coordinates.

[01:44:47] Greg McHale: Uh, with the inReach as well to, to get, uh, I had to get a helicopter out of there. Wow. Yeah. So it was, yeah, it was not, not amazing. And then one of those, so that was that 600 hours, man. That was that, that time when Greg thought that he was had it all. Like he, I know how to fly this plane and this is, I've got it all under control.

[01:45:10] Greg McHale: And then, uh, and then you don't. And you're just, some days, you know, you're lucky to walk away from it. And in that situation, I've had a number of them that, uh, that I was just lucky to walk away from that and go back to the family and shake it off and go, holy crap, Greg. Like you can't, uh, you got, you got to think a little more deeply.

[01:45:29] Travis Bader: Yeah. Cause it's not just you. 

[01:45:31] Greg McHale: It's not just me. 

[01:45:33] Travis Bader: Is there anything that we haven't talked about that we should be talking about? 

[01:45:35] Greg McHale: Buddy, I think that, you know, I, I think that we've covered, uh, we've covered a lot and it's, it's been an amazing conversation and I can see that, uh, Blue here is, uh, he's getting, he's getting antsy and ready to go.

[01:45:48] Greg McHale: And I got to, You know, compliment compliment him right now for being able to, to hang out through all, through all this and listen to his dad. So thanks buddy. 

[01:45:57] Travis Bader: Yeah. I don't know if I could do the same at that age. I would have been all over the place. ADHD galore. 

[01:46:03] Greg McHale: Well, it is, it is really interesting. Cause, um, this was, I think a bit of a test to be, and I think you passed a flying colors because outside, as soon as we're like, just doesn't stop.

[01:46:14] Greg McHale: Like there's just, there is no stop button. So having the ability to, uh, To be able to hang here with us is, uh, it's awesome, man. 

[01:46:23] Travis Bader: Colter, you've been amazing. Really awesome having you in here, Greg. Thank you so much for the conversation and thanks for being on the Silvercore podcast. 

[01:46:30] Greg McHale: Yeah. Thank you, Travis.

[01:46:31] Greg McHale: It's been, it's been absolute pleasure. Um, I really enjoyed talking to you. We haven't, uh, and I hope to do it. I hope to do it again sometime. It's been, it's been fantastic. We 

[01:46:42] Travis Bader: definitely will.