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Silvercore Podcast 137 Trevor Gibbs Manbar

[00:00:00] Travis Bader: I have to say that one of my most favorite things about doing the Silvercore podcast is getting to meet some extraordinary people, people who are doing positive things, amazing things all over the world, and I get to learn from them and I get to share that enthusiasm and their passion for what they do.

[00:00:29] Travis Bader: With you, a by product of doing the podcast is oftentimes I'll get invites to go and do some pretty cool things. Most often I don't take people up on these invites and my friends will rib me about it. They say, Travis, you've got to be a yes man. People would kill for these opportunities. Yes. I'd come out hunting with you.

[00:00:48] Travis Bader: Yes. I'd come fishing with you. Yes. I'd come visit you in your neck of the world. And I'm starting to lean into that. I see a lot of value to going out and experiencing these adventures with other people in areas of the world that typically I wouldn't be going to and sharing those experiences with you.

[00:01:11] Travis Bader: Recently, Brad Brooks of Silvercore podcast, episodes 57 and episode number 73 put out a call inviting people to a barbecue that he's having at his place, our galley in Boise, Idaho. And I thought, what the heck? It's only what? 10 hours away by driving here from lower mainland British Columbia. Jumped into the truck way, went, let's do this barbecue.

[00:01:35] Travis Bader: Had a great time, got to meet some amazing people. There is some giveaways, great food, tacos, beer. And of course, Brad, it was really good to meet you in person. Of course, going down to Boise, had to reach out to Zachary Hanson. He wrote the book, turning feral, and he was in Silvercore podcast, episode number 94.

[00:01:55] Travis Bader: Zachary says, of course I'm on board. I'll meet you there. Unfortunately, there's a bit of mix up on the dates and Zach had welding school that evening. He says, don't worry about it. Tell you what, before I go to go to school the next day, 0630, let's meet at Merritt's restaurant in Boise. World famous for its scones.

[00:02:16] Travis Bader: As a Canadian, personally, I would call those doughnuts, but I would say they were world famous doughnuts. They were so good. Talking with Zach, he's got a new book coming out. I'm really excited to talk about it. I don't know if I'm allowed to yet, but. When it does come out, I'm sure you're going to be hearing about it here on the Silvercore podcast, I have a feeling it's going to be highly influential and it's going to make a big impact in the same way that books like Michael Easter's Comfort Crisis have made a pretty big impact on the world.

[00:02:46] Travis Bader: Zachary says, Travis, I've written about Atlanta, Idaho, and my book Turning Feral. You got to check the place out. Population 37 people currently, here's the code to get in, here's the wifi password. Go there, check out the Sawtooth, you'll love it. In fact, there's some great fishing along the way. He lent me a Tenkara rod.

[00:03:10] Travis Bader: I'd never Tenkara fished before. And for those who haven't heard of it, it's a collapsible fishing rod that they make and it just pulls out into a pretty long rod, but it can basically fit in your pocket. It goes pretty small. It doesn't have a reel and it's a different style, really easy to get the hang of this thing.

[00:03:29] Travis Bader: I went out there, I was in the Sawtooths, visions of Hemingway in the Sun Valley fishing, and I can't remember a time when I've caught more fish or had a better day on the river than that. Almost every single cast I was catching, beautiful rainbow trout, it was 40 degrees out, which is 104 if you're American, smoking hot outside, cool water on my feet.

[00:03:54] Travis Bader: And usually when you catch them with a lake, there can be a little bit muddy. These were fatty, river run, clean, crisp flavor. It was amazing. Top that all up, hot springs in the evening, sit in the cold river, waterfall of hot water coming over my back. Had an amazing time down there. So I guess what I'm trying to get at here is I'm going to be leaning into this.

[00:04:17] Travis Bader: I'm going to take the advice of My friends who say, be a yes man. Yes, I'll go hunting with you. Yes, I'll take you up on your offer for this adventure. And I would encourage others that are listening to this to maybe stop, assess and evaluate, and look at the opportunities that you're getting. Where can you say yes?

[00:04:38] Travis Bader: Where can you lean into these different adventures and opportunities that will inevitably present themselves to you? And how would your life be different? If you took the route of just saying yes, if you're a member of the Silvercore club, you should already know that we've got a number of different brand partners.

[00:05:01] Travis Bader: One of which being Nanook, and they are a Canadian company that may robust cases for anything you can think of different shapes and sizes. Uh, you get 30 percent off of their cases. That's a wicked savings. And if you're following us on social media, you should be You'll see that we're going to be giving away one of these guys here.

[00:05:21] Travis Bader: It's an Anuk T30 case. We're also going to be giving away the Anuk 990. That's a rifle case with foam. It's got the wheels. They're renowned for their latches which won't open up unless you want them to open up. And in which case they open up really easily. Quality handles. I don't know what more I can say.

[00:05:40] Travis Bader: Like if you've, if you've used it, you know, they're, they're good quality equipment. They're good. They'll keep your stuff safe. So follow us on social media, follow Silvercore Outdoors, subscribe to the podcast and please. If you find value in these podcasts, share them with others. As we grow, we get more opportunities and we're able to go out and interview interesting people all over the world, interact with them and share that with you.

[00:06:08] Travis Bader: So without further ado. Let's get this one rolling. I love engaging with fellow entrepreneurs. They embark on uncharted paths filled with hard work and uncertainty yet driven by an unmistakable passion for success. Today's guest embodies this spirit with a deep love for hunting, cooking, and the outdoors.

[00:06:28] Travis Bader: He has identified and capitalized on a gap in the marketplace for a nutrient dense grass finished bison and beef meat snack, all while maintaining a commitment to quality and sustainability through his company, Man Bar. Man Bar. Welcome to the Silvercore podcast, Trevor Gibbs. 

[00:06:43] Trevor Gibbs: Thank you. 

[00:06:44] Travis Bader: Pleasure to be here.

[00:06:45] Travis Bader: There we go. So did I get that intro done? Right. Sounds good, man. Right on. So, um, it's kind of fortuitous how we met. Now you just flew into town last night. Yes. And, uh, coming from Texas there. Texas, Austin, Texas. The great state of Texas. Absolutely. I remember I was, uh, Uh, maybe I don't want to admit this, but I was rollerblading for the theory terminal when I was, uh, please say last week.

[00:07:14] Travis Bader: I think it was about 19, 20 years old. And I thought. I didn't have the, um, I don't know if my car wasn't working or if I didn't have money for fuel, but I wanted to go surfing. So I had to get to Tofino. I don't like, I got a set of roller blades and I filled my backpack up and I got off this ferry terminal.

[00:07:31] Travis Bader: I figured I'm going to roller blade from the Nanaimo ferry terminal to, or Duke point, I think it was Duke point ferry terminal over to Tofino. And that's, that's a bit of a, That's a bit of a roller blade. All right. And, um, I remember my first big hill we're going down and I was used to hills, but never the big backpack.

[00:07:48] Travis Bader: It was long and sustained. I'm going faster and faster and faster. I'm getting these wobbles in this thing. I'm like, Oh, I got to get the brakes on and I'm dragging the blade and dragging all the way down. I'm like, maybe I should take up hitchhiking. So I got this one guy. Only person to pull over and pitch up, pick up this.

[00:08:06] Travis Bader: I think it was six, six, probably 220 pound guy, scruffy looking, dirty backpack, all the rest. And, uh, he was massive. He made me look small and he picks us up. It picks me and my buddy up and he's gripping the steering wheel and the whole steering wheel is flexing. And he's talking about coming from the great state of Texas.

[00:08:30] Travis Bader: Amazing. He says, you know, I spent some time in the great state of Texas. They got a great program down there. And by time, it means he spent some time in jail. Yeah. And, um, yeah, that, that was an interesting road trip. He was a demolitions expert and he says, Oh, in the back, I got all these explosives. And he's given stories about putting, uh, blasting caps in people's lap and, but they're duds and lighten them and duct taping some guy up who was doing something with his wife and like, he was everything.

[00:08:56] Travis Bader: Angry, massive and a demolitions expert. So that was, um, probably the first person that I had met from the great state of Texas. 

[00:09:05] Trevor Gibbs: And now you got me. And now I got you. Now I got you. That's a tough act to follow. 

[00:09:11] Travis Bader: So tell me a little bit about yourself. Uh, you're, you're a smart guy. Thank you. You come from a, uh, an interesting background, but, uh, I want to get into all of that.

[00:09:22] Travis Bader: Everything you're doing with the, uh, the man bar and the business. But I want to know a bit about you first. Sure. 

[00:09:26] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. Grew up in, in Austin, uh, was there through high school and then obsessed with basketball when I was younger, played a lot of team sports. Um, but yeah, just, just was kind of in Austin doing my thing.

[00:09:45] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. Um, finished high school, went to school in East Texas. And then I think. Kind of the summer after I graduated, I went to Europe, did the whole Euro trip thing over there for a few months and I had studied, studied engineering and math in, as for my undergrad and went to, didn't really know what I was going to do, went to Europe, doing the backpacking thing and then loved it, really fell in love with, I had done some traveling beforehand, but that was my first like extensive three month trip to Europe.

[00:10:21] Trevor Gibbs: Four months, however, however long I was going to travel. Mm. Um, and so I kind of had the plan. I was just gonna stay over there and, and find at the time, you know, maybe it was my youthful ignorance, but I was just like, I just got a degree in physics degrees in physics and math. Like, I'll find something. 

[00:10:40] Travis Bader: Oh, they'll hire me.

[00:10:41] Travis Bader: No problem. Everyone's looking for a mathematician or a physicist. Yeah. 

[00:10:43] Trevor Gibbs: Everyone's looking for that. Yeah. And so, um, that, that was kind of the plan. Uh, I was. The initial phases of that, but then I found out I got into grad school. And so got into grad school, uh, at Texas A& M for engineering for petroleum engineering.

[00:11:02] Trevor Gibbs: So I was sitting in. Gosh, I don't even remember what country, but I was still in Europe and I was, I got this offer, basically go to grad school for free. And, and it was like, well, all right, worst case scenario. Let me go do that for two years. And then I'll come back. Um, 

[00:11:19] Travis Bader: that's kind of hard to pass up. Yeah, 

[00:11:20] Trevor Gibbs: yeah, exactly.

[00:11:22] Trevor Gibbs: So, uh, I, Went back, went back to Texas, did my two semesters or did two semesters at A& M for grad school and then was asked myself and two other guys were asked to go kick off the grad program at their satellite campus in Qatar in the Middle East. Yeah. And so I jumped on it because my whole, whether it was Europe or Middle East or whatever, I just wanted to, to tour outside of the U S I just, uh, I wanted to see the world.

[00:11:55] Trevor Gibbs: That was kind of number one on my priority at that time. What was pushing you? What was driving you? I don't know. Yeah. Um, yeah, I don't know. There, there was just a, a, a very, I was just fascinated by the world, by cultures, by languages, by food, by, by seeing something new. Yeah. And, and for whatever reason it just took hold of me and, uh.

[00:12:24] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah, I don't know how, I'm not quite sure how else to articulate it, but it was just something that was very important to me. And so I saw that as an opportunity to go over there if I did good work, potentially that would speed track me working overseas. And so I did, I went over there and there were three of us, there were the, the reason why is because they were only a few years old and so they had all this, the Qatari National Research Foundation had funded a bunch of grad product projects, but they were only, I think the oldest people at the school were going into their junior year, so they needed a few people to go over there to, to kick it off.

[00:13:09] Trevor Gibbs: Sure. Did that, jumped on a project, was able to, uh, help, yeah, really help kickstart it cause, cause we were the first ones. Yeah. So, I nerded out on, uh, Gosh, what was my thesis? It was, it was a well placement optimization using genetic algorithms. Well, placement 

[00:13:33] Travis Bader: optimization. So we're talking like oil wells or water wells.

[00:13:37] Travis Bader: You want to oil and gas. Yeah. 

[00:13:39] Trevor Gibbs: So oil well based on genetic, genetic algorithms, which is essentially like a self What's the best way, like a self learning algorithm almost where, uh, the best way to think of a checkerboard or a 

[00:13:54] Travis Bader: chessboard 

[00:13:55] Trevor Gibbs: most times when you're running an optimization, let's say there's, I don't even know how many squares are on a checkerboard.

[00:14:01] Trevor Gibbs: Let's say there's a hundred. Sure. Essentially what you're doing is each of those squares has different properties, porosity, permeability, whatever. Yeah. Um, you've got to run a, a. Basically run a project, not project was the word I'm looking for. You've got to run a, an iteration for each square. 

[00:14:25] Travis Bader: Okay. 

[00:14:26] Trevor Gibbs: And so for that one, I'd have to run a hundred and then at the end I get a hundred answers and then that spits out the, you know, ideally where, where the well placement would go.

[00:14:36] Trevor Gibbs: Right. The best place to drill based on all these different factors. Based on all the, you know, 10, 12, 15 different factors. And so what? My program did, and kind of the initial stages of it is how do we take that a hundred iterations and make it 80 or 70. 

[00:14:57] Travis Bader: Right. 

[00:14:58] Trevor Gibbs: It doesn't matter when it's that low of a number, but when it's not a hundred and it's a million or 10 million, it's, you know, it's a, it's a big difference in time and energy and all of that.

[00:15:10] Trevor Gibbs: So, so how would genetics play into that? Well, it's the, that part is basically you're signing multiple. You assign multiple parameters for what you're looking for, and then it's, it's basically running those iterations at random and kind of taking those answers to identify where kind of whittled down to where the best, best, uh, option would be.

[00:15:39] Trevor Gibbs: And so, for example, if you've got that checkerboard, let's say the top right half, it's just getting bad answers, but down here it's getting higher answers. Well, it's going to start running a few more down here. And then it'll check, maybe it'll kind of like mind sweeper. It's like, all right, that one, let me check these ones over here.

[00:15:57] Trevor Gibbs: And it just kind of whittles down to an answer. And so that it, it was able to, yeah, essentially do that. And so take those a hundred iterations and make it 70 or 75, whatever it may be. So that was like the first part. That's what I did on like a, Three or four year project. 

[00:16:15] Travis Bader: So here's the ADHD tangent for you.

[00:16:17] Travis Bader: Sure. Okay. So I don't know much of anything about drilling for oil wells. Sure. But I know very little bit about drilling for water. Okay. And people are trying to find the best spot to drill for water. And back in the day, they used to do divining or dowsing. Have you heard of this before? Okay. They'd use or witching stick.

[00:16:37] Travis Bader: They'd take a switch from a willow tree and they'd walk around with that and see where it kind of wanted to dip down. Okay. Okay. I'm wondering, I know in the water drilling business, they still have people that'll come in and they'll do water dowsing or divining, and they'll walk around with their witching sticks, or they'll take a couple.

[00:16:57] Travis Bader: Try it when I was a kid, I took broom handles, I drilled a hole in the center. I just cut a couple of chunks and I put a 90 degree, um, coat hanger in it. And so you hold on these things and when the coat hanger kind of crosses over, it comes back. I mean, like, you It's sort of a Ouija board world of finding.

[00:17:15] Travis Bader: I find it odd and interesting that people will still do that for water. Does that play any role? And I guess by the fact that you don't, you've never heard of this, any role into looking for oil, 

[00:17:27] Trevor Gibbs: man, I'm sure in the early days, there was some of that going on, but, um, I'm unaware of any. 

[00:17:36] Travis Bader: Not aware 

[00:17:36] Trevor Gibbs: of that now.

[00:17:37] Travis Bader: Not what you and the other pros are doing. I, yeah, I, I have never 

[00:17:40] Trevor Gibbs: done that. Well, we'll put it that way. 

[00:17:42] Travis Bader: Oh, what a fun way to make a living. Fair enough. Sorry. You go on. I can't, 

[00:17:48] Trevor Gibbs: yeah, that's all good. So it's, uh, so yeah, once, uh, once grad school for that ended up. Graduating and was fortunate enough to get a job to stay over there.

[00:17:59] Trevor Gibbs: So caught the attention of a couple of companies and, um, yeah, ended up signing with a Danish company and spent the next couple of years between, between there. And I was living in Doha and, and, uh, Copenhagen and so, and then between just the way our schedules worked, it's basically, I would spend a third of my time.

[00:18:22] Trevor Gibbs: In the office, a third of the time offshore, and then a third of my time, I got off basically for the time on the rig. Hmm. And so, in that time off, I was in such an amazing location in the Middle East to get to, within ten, a ten hour flight, I mean, you're in most of Asia, most of Africa, even into Europe, and it like, you can just, you're so close to, And so just anytime I had, if I had four days off or more, I was, I was on a plane going somewhere.

[00:18:59] Trevor Gibbs: Really? So I spent, spent quite a few years of just every, you know, almost like every three weeks I was, I was either in Doha, I was in the office or I was traveling somewhere that I hadn't been before. And that was just my, my life and, and I loved it and it was great. And, uh, It's quite the adventure. Yeah.

[00:19:19] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. Maybe that's what you asked earlier. Maybe, maybe that's what I was seeking. 

[00:19:23] Travis Bader: You know, everyone's got this different, you know, they talk about the travel bug and they've been bitten by the travel bug and they want to go check things out. I remember, so I turned 20 in Greece. I was in Greek islands and.

[00:19:37] Travis Bader: Beautiful. Yeah. 

[00:19:39] Trevor Gibbs: Unbelievable. 

[00:19:39] Travis Bader: It was great. But the, the thing that. I found out about three, four months over there, like yourself, around that age, got out of high school and had plans to do one thing that didn't pan out. And so I thought, well, I got this money saved up. I'm already over here. Let's let's travel around a bit.

[00:19:55] Travis Bader: But the one thing that really struck me was how. You know, I was raised in a, in a certain way, and there's a right way to do things. And the people that don't do it that way, they're doing it wrong. I was struck to see all the people doing it the wrong way. And I'm using air brackets here for people listening and thriving and doing so well.

[00:20:15] Travis Bader: And that really just, it was a bit of an aha moment and everything I'd known up into that point, it's like, wait a minute, there's a lot more going on out here. And it really ignited that curiosity in me about. Different cultures, different traditions, different ways that people do. And for me, that all kind of revolved around food and the people.

[00:20:36] Travis Bader: Because I didn't have much money. I had enough to get up and get over there. So I would sleep on beaches, right? I, uh, sorry to say it. I nicked a tarp out in Austin. I made a little bit of a tent out of it. And, uh, Um, slept under that for a while, for a week or so up in the Alps and, but I would use my money to buy decent food and try to find interest, like get away from the tourist zones and try and find people that are doing just a regular life, which again was.

[00:21:06] Travis Bader: The wrong way of doing it from the way that I was raised, but they're thriving. So I loved that aspect for me, that that's where a lot of the adventure kind of came in. 

[00:21:15] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, that, that, that resonates for sure. Um, yeah, it was just the kind of to touch on both of the food and the people. I mean, a story that comes to mind is I was in, I took my mom to Sri Lanka when I was over there and we went and literally the first place we ate, we I think, cause we're in a small village and the manager came up to us and was asking us like, kind of, what are y'all two doing here?

[00:21:43] Trevor Gibbs: Um, you know, but in a polite way, and so, you know, it just kind of long story short, just worked out that we were going to be where he was from at the same time he was getting off work and, and going home cause he was, you know, he lived, you know, Was working away from home and then would work for three, four, five days and then go home for, you know, three, four, five days.

[00:22:04] Trevor Gibbs: And, and so we just happened to be going to be in the same place those, those days. And so he invited us to come to his home for dinner and, uh, you know, and so we went and we, we just, yeah, just this man I've never, we'd never met before. We just, he invited us to his house, they cook this. Equivalent of just this monster, like Thanksgiving didn't, I guess you don't have Thanksgiving up here, but yeah, 

[00:22:29] Travis Bader: we got a, we have it on a different day, but we got a Thanksgiving, but 

[00:22:34] Trevor Gibbs: you know, just this crazy spread of all this homemade, uh, Sri Lankan food and his wife and his daughter had been like cooking all, like literally all day over wood fire stoves and stuff like that.

[00:22:44] Trevor Gibbs: And it was just, you know, I turned to my mom and, and I was just like, Remember this, because this doesn't happen often and like, this is incredible, you know? And it was just, we're two normal people. They were a normal family, you know? And, and it was just, it was amazing. 

[00:23:01] Travis Bader: And you probably never really see that in Texas to yet people saying, Hey, where are you, where are you from?

[00:23:05] Travis Bader: Where are you going to? Why don't you come over to my house? Happens once in a while, but not the most 

[00:23:11] Trevor Gibbs: common. Texas is pretty friendly, man. It's uh, yeah, there, there's this whole Southern hospitality thing that it probably not like that. Okay. Where it's just some random person that you grab, you know, and say, Hey, you come over for dinner.

[00:23:26] Trevor Gibbs: But. 

[00:23:28] Travis Bader: So here in Vancouver and Canada, we've got this reputation for being super friendly. And I'll tell you that sort of thing doesn't really happen over here. Um, I know traveling is It happens a fair bit and I'm, you know, when I was younger, I'd always have like, what does this person want? What do they want from him?

[00:23:46] Travis Bader: Like I was traveling by myself and people are like, Oh, where are you staying? Oh, you know, I'm, you know, staying over here. Why do you come to my place? No, no, no, no. Right. Like, what does this person want? But the number of times people would invite you to stay over, invite you. Um, I remember when I came down from the mountainside that I was camping in for a little over a week and figured I'd live off the land up there for a while.

[00:24:08] Travis Bader: And it's just starved essentially. Yeah, practice your 

[00:24:11] Trevor Gibbs: fasting. 

[00:24:12] Travis Bader: Exactly. Practice my fasting and I must have stunk and looked terrible. So I come back down, I've returned the tarp, so the person only deprived of it temporarily. Yeah. And, um, This husband and wife come on down and they see me and I'm catching a bus out.

[00:24:29] Travis Bader: Oh, where, where are you going? And tell him where I'm going to go. And why don't you come and get food with us? We'll go over, we'll get a pizza. I'm like, no, no, no, no. I don't want you paying for anything. Right. And, oh no, no, no, we'll get it for you. And I said, no, this is the last bus. I got to get out. They walk away, they come back.

[00:24:42] Travis Bader: Okay, we've got to figure it out. You'll stay with us. We'll get some food. And the number of times I found that in life to happen, when you kind of put yourself out there, I is, and maybe that's it, maybe in your hometown, you're not putting yourself out there, maybe it does happen for other people. And, um, um, but there's, there's an interesting energy to things that I think people can kind of pick up on.

[00:25:05] Travis Bader: And maybe that's amplified when you're traveling. 

[00:25:07] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah, yeah, that's probably a good way to put it. It's, uh, there's certainly, certainly an openness to new newness. Newness. Yeah. Um, I mean, one of my favorite, I always say one of my favorite feelings in the world is I travel a little differently. And normally when I'm doing stuff like that, I typically don't pre plan like where I'm going to stay or, or any of that.

[00:25:33] Trevor Gibbs: And so I really fell in love with just showing up to a new place, having no idea what. What, what I was going to do, where I was going to stay, any of that. And just this quote unquote, figuring it out. 

[00:25:48] Travis Bader: Yeah. Cause the universal unfold as it should. 

[00:25:50] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. And so it was a lot of travel is that way. And for me, and there's something to it and maybe it's a skill that you can get better at and chip away at, but I think that adaptability to, to, you know, Be open and accept kind of whatever, whatever it is.

[00:26:13] Travis Bader: Well, that's a huge thing for an entrepreneur to be able to be adaptable. Did traveling kind of hone that in you, or did it kind of spark that in you? Like, did you always have that adaptable nature? Or did you kind of 

[00:26:26] Trevor Gibbs: find it? That's probably a better question for my mom. Um, but yeah, it should have brought her.

[00:26:32] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. I don't know. I mean, it, it came very naturally. Um, so maybe it was there and I was just in a Place where that made sense. Hmm. Um, but yeah, I mean, in, in general and, and I've never really thought about it, but maybe it does come from the travel, but like in general I do, whether it's emotionally or whatever is part of it, that adaptability and just being open to things going wrong or not being exactly how you want.

[00:27:05] Trevor Gibbs: Or I've kind of feel like in a lot of ways I've removed myself from. Uh, what's the word being, being process oriented versus, uh, outcome oriented. 

[00:27:17] Travis Bader: Okay. 

[00:27:18] Trevor Gibbs: And so, so explain 

[00:27:19] Travis Bader: that, like, how would, how would that work in your life being process oriented as opposed to outcome oriented? 

[00:27:24] Trevor Gibbs: Well, I mean, uh, a big one is, is, is with these sticks, um, which we can dive into later.

[00:27:34] Trevor Gibbs: I can dive into it now. So, you know, I would just say that I, like, I don't view. So I've been working on this company for, for call it two years. Okay. We just launched like Monday from when we're talking just a few days ago. I sent out all the initial orders. Right. And so it's very new, but my, my thought process through these last two years and even going forward, uh, the success of this company or, or the outcome of this company, I haven't really thought about in terms of like dollars, for example.

[00:28:15] Trevor Gibbs: I've got, yeah, like, like, I can't tell you, I want to be a 5 million company, a 50 million to whatever, like, like that to me isn't really how I define success with this. How do you define success? Well, so far it's, the success has been, I've created, I formulated, created, whatever you want to call it, something that scratched my own itch.

[00:28:40] Trevor Gibbs: That, I think is in the feedback I've been getting and a lot that people agree with is it's the best tasting stick on the market, excuse me. Um, but yeah, scratch the niche of just wanting all the things I wanted in a meat stick, um, which we can go into, but as long as I can keep the quality, what it is, as long as I can continue to support people, which is really like if there was one word through all this, it would be support.

[00:29:14] Trevor Gibbs: And that I realized. As I was making this that like, like we were talking about earlier, I hate being the center of attention. 

[00:29:20] Travis Bader: Yeah. If we can do this, but 

[00:29:23] Trevor Gibbs: You know, it's like, I, there's only so much you can say about a stick, even though I think this one's great. And it's got a really bunch of really cool features and benefits that we can talk about.

[00:29:31] Trevor Gibbs: But really the, the way that this thing's going to be used as supporting people like you, when you're going out in the woods and you're teaching people, it's going to support, you know, My buddies who are real estate agents who are zipping all around town, it's going to help my friends who are single mothers or, or new mothers who need a snack, both for them and their kid, they're running them around.

[00:29:54] Trevor Gibbs: It's for my buddy Blake, who is Always in the outdoors. It's for me when I'm hunting. It's for, you know, it's all these applications where people are doing hard, interesting things and taking pride in their work 

[00:30:10] Travis Bader: and 

[00:30:11] Trevor Gibbs: just, if, if they can have this and do that for 30 minutes longer, or a couple hours longer, or whatever it may be like, that's what makes me happy.

[00:30:22] Trevor Gibbs: And so as long as I can. Obviously not go bankrupt or, you know, I need to create a successful company. I'm not, you know, and certainly the physics, excuse me, the physics and engineering me, like likes to nerd out on the numbers. 

[00:30:36] Travis Bader: Yeah. That's something in my, all my engineer buddies, they'll tell me it's, it's, it's sort of a curse of the engineer world.

[00:30:43] Travis Bader: They'll nickel and dime you to death. Cause they're looking at numbers left and right 

[00:30:48] Trevor Gibbs: to that there's to that though. It's like, certainly I'm, I'm on top of the numbers, but. comes in is because there's not like a number that I'm chasing. It's also allows me to do Those sticks. I got you. So like for this, it makes no sense to spend money on butcher paper and twine and this compostable sticker and the compostable mailer.

[00:31:17] Trevor Gibbs: We put it in. Those are all pretty, there's cheaper ways to do it, but this has a different feel to it. And I've had, you know, a lot of people that have, I've given these to just in the last couple of days, they grab it. And they're like, oh man, this feels like I, this is cool, I just feel like I came back from the butcher.

[00:31:41] Trevor Gibbs: That's right! And now I don't know,

[00:31:47] Trevor Gibbs: I don't know what that means from a, from a monetary standpoint. But I know there's value in that, if that makes sense. Like, I don't know how to put that, that saying in a spreadsheet of like, this is why I'm doing it. Cause that, cause that guy says that he really loves it. Cause it feels like he came from the butcher.

[00:32:04] Travis Bader: Well, it's important to have a feeling associated with a product. You know, Simon Sinek, have you seen or heard of him? I'm familiar with him. Okay. So I remember back in the day, there's a YouTube video, I think it was a Ted talk he was given or a lecture he's given on the golden circle. He talks about, and he says, people don't Buy what you do, they buy, um, why you do it or they don't buy what it is.

[00:32:27] Travis Bader: And he gives, he has a number of examples, right? And he talks about, um, uh, like Apple computers. Apple doesn't say, Hey, uh, we got the fastest processor, we've got the brightest monitor. We've got the ABC. It says, um, We'll help you unleash your creativity. Sure. You're, you're unique, right? There's something that people want to identify with when they're engaging in a product or a service.

[00:32:50] Travis Bader: Right. Uh, there's always going to be those who will go for the absolute cheapest thing that they can find. Sure. But I think if you want a sustainable, uh, product or service, there should be an ethos behind it that speaks to the individual. Cause that'll drive you as an entrepreneur, that'll keep you striving to ensure that you're putting out the best quality product and that, uh, you're innovating and doing things in a way.

[00:33:15] Travis Bader: And then there's The people who subscribe to that will pay for that because they want to know that they're getting something that has that heart and soul behind it. And it's not just some mass produced thing that's been, been pumped out. 

[00:33:27] Trevor Gibbs: Right. Yeah, no, exactly. So it's trying to, even though it doesn't make economic sense or even, you know, time resource sense, time, energy, money to do it there.

[00:33:40] Trevor Gibbs: There's. It does from a monetary standpoint, from a feeling energy vibe enjoyment aspect. Absolutely. 

[00:33:51] Travis Bader: I think there's a bit of a toss up there too. So obviously profits got to be an important piece of the puzzle. If you want to have something that's sustainable over the longterm, it has to have enough revenue coming in, in order to sustain that, right.

[00:34:05] Travis Bader: That's a very important piece. And quite often we find ourselves, uh, like with subscription model type, uh, services, which by the way, you should have a, uh, man bar subscription model. We've 

[00:34:18] Trevor Gibbs: on the website, we've got a monthly, uh, monthly option there. So, 

[00:34:22] Travis Bader: so you look at like Amazon prime. Okay. That was a pretty cool thing.

[00:34:26] Travis Bader: You get free shipping. That's not too bad. Prime membership for a year. If I buy X amount of stuff, I get free shipping back. Then. They bring in upgrades and they say, well, now we have, we've got music too, and we've got TV and we've got cloud storage space and it gets bigger and bigger and it's all the same price.

[00:34:44] Travis Bader: And then the money starts to like the service, everything looks fantastic. And then the, um, shareholders start getting in and everyone says, well, how do we squeeze a bit more money out of it? Yeah. Well, now the TV's got ads and now you've got to get different subscriptions to Crave and Hulu and all the rest under it.

[00:35:02] Travis Bader: So there's, there seems to be a bit of a life cycle to these things. And the bigger it gets, it kind of kills that, um, the soul of it, the soul of it. Right. Yeah. Yeah. And this right now is the soul of it. This is you. And if you're able to sustain that soul, I think that model of always pursuing excellence, because that's an abstract thought that's probably never going to be able to be achieved, but you can always pursue it.

[00:35:31] Travis Bader: Money is going to be a natural by product of your hard work and efforts. 

[00:35:35] Trevor Gibbs: I think so too. I mean, uh, and, and that's kind of the way I've been approaching it and hopefully we'll continue to approach it for as long as we're around. 

[00:35:43] Travis Bader: Yeah. And you know, and so I've looked at things and it's, maybe it's worked out, maybe it hasn't.

[00:35:48] Travis Bader: I don't know. I don't look at the money. Right. But, uh, uh, it seems to be working out, um, and do get people lecturing me saying I should be looking at the money more and I should really have spreadsheets out. And it's just, that's not where my head's at. That's not where my head's at. And I find that, uh, by creating a quality product and having engaging with, uh, the end user and others around you in a meaningful way, it keeps me interested.

[00:36:11] Travis Bader: And if it was just the money I'd be bored. 

[00:36:13] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. Yeah. I always like, uh, God, who is he talking to? Dave Chappelle did an interview for forever ago and, and he was talking about telling his dad that he wanted, wanted to be a comedian. 

[00:36:27] Travis Bader: Hmm. 

[00:36:28] Trevor Gibbs: And, you know, his dad's response was kind of the typical, like, well, you know, do something else, have some other skill as a backup.

[00:36:37] Trevor Gibbs: Not many people make it, you know, it's hard, blah, blah, blah. And Chappelle's response to that was like, cause I think it's, Again, I may be messing up some details, but I think his father was a teacher and, and Chappelle was like, well, how much do you make as a teacher? You know? And at the time it was like, let's say 30 grand and Dave Chappelle was like, all right, well, if I can make 30 grand a year, but doing what I love, then like, isn't like, isn't that making it?

[00:37:04] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. And his dad was like, keep that attitude and you're going to be just fine. Yeah. No kidding. And so a bit of it is, you know, to bring that to this, obviously we're going to give this thing our best shot. I hope it blows up. Great. But if I make, if I can keep doing this and I can make, let's say 30 grand a year from it, but I'm meeting people like you going to talk with Kelsey, who I met, like the amount of networking I've been able to do prior to even having a launch product makes me very optimistic for what the next one, two, three, five, 10 years looks like.

[00:37:45] Trevor Gibbs: And so it's, you know, if it's only ever 30 grand and I'm doing this on the weekends or, you know, getting on, going on cool hunting trips or fishing trips or just meeting, I told you some of our, our plans, you know, at the end of the month, I'm hoping to do a big, like wild hog cookoff launch slash launch party down, down in Austin.

[00:38:05] Trevor Gibbs: Like I can do that stuff and, and again, support what other people are doing and people find genuine utility using this. I mean, that's awesome. So when are you doing this cookoff? It'll probably be, it'll be after this is released, but it'll be. So we're in July. Yeah, it'll be the ideas for it to be the end of July.

[00:38:25] Trevor Gibbs: So next week when I go home, we're going to start shooting the first episodes of the, uh, The right now, what I'm calling the first hunt series. And that will be my version of a podcast where it's kind of a rigging out my truck to be a mobile podcast studio and essentially going to take people on their first hunts, which in Texas kind of a, it's kind of like a one on one first entry idea where there's so many entrepreneurs that, and not just entrepreneurs, but just people that talk to me about hunting and how to get started.

[00:38:57] Trevor Gibbs: Hmm. We're basically just going to take them if they need to go to the gun range, we'll go to the gun range, get some lessons in, and then just going to go sit in a blind and hunt wild pigs, because that's kind of the easiest barrier to entry, especially down in Texas. Um, and so being an invasive 

[00:39:13] Travis Bader: species, the, the, Wild pigs there.

[00:39:15] Travis Bader: So good old razzle dazzle Rick Brazel, he's got a organization called the First Hunt Foundation and he takes out, um, uh, kids. Basically it's kids, kids who've, uh, you know, most people will get into hunting because of a family member. Traditionally it's been male dominated. So father, uncle, but a lot of mothers out there hunting too.

[00:39:37] Travis Bader: And he'll take, um, people who've, who've never been out, who've never hunted, and they'll help them get started on their sort of first hunt. So they got a first hunt foundation. Uh, might be an interesting guy to reach out to as well, honestly. I 

[00:39:50] Trevor Gibbs: wasn't aware of that. That's awesome. 

[00:39:51] Travis Bader: Yeah. 

[00:39:53] Trevor Gibbs: The, the Texas parks and wildlife has a, they call it stewards of the wild.

[00:39:57] Travis Bader: Okay. 

[00:39:58] Trevor Gibbs: And it's a similar thing where, where it's basically a group that you can sign up for and they offer hunting trips, fishing trips, uh, all sorts of stuff where they assign you a mentor and, and yeah, you'll go out and basically learn how to do these things. So, 

[00:40:14] Travis Bader: well, that's one of the things that's sorely missing in the, uh, In the hunting community is easy access to mentors.

[00:40:22] Travis Bader: Like if you don't know somebody, like what are you going to do? Get on an online forum and start asking people, good luck with that. Uh, you're just going to get flamed. I know some people, they're like, I'll just put, I'll change my name. Some guy, I'm going to change my name to Jen, I'll put an attractive looking girl that I'll ask all my questions to that one.

[00:40:39] Travis Bader: That's funny. Uh, other people will go on hunting for, or sorry, hiking forums and say, Oh, I'm really looking to find a X, Y, Z animal, right? Has anyone seen one in their hikes, right? And finding that there are a little less tight lipped about, uh, about sharing it. But in British Columbia, we don't have a dedicated sort of mentorship program or steward program.

[00:41:01] Travis Bader: And I know in, in Washington, uh, they've got a program where, uh, If you're a qualified individual, you've passed the, uh, uh, in Canada, we call them an enhanced reliability check, which is done by the, the RCMP, but basically it's the PERV check. Make sure you're, you're going to be a decent person to take other people out.

[00:41:22] Travis Bader: Right. And, um, I, so in Washington, these guys will take others out and mentor them hunting. And as a reward for that, the following year, they have increased odds for their limited entry hunting. And I've pushed our province to enact something similar. Government moves really slow, but it's something that, uh, that I've been working on trying to get over in BC.

[00:41:47] Travis Bader: And in fact, uh, Rick Brazel talking with him about those sorts of things, but that might also be, I don't know how the steward program works. Um, in BC, one of the concerns is, are you a guide now? And there's a step on the guide outfitters and is this a guided hunting, but in Texas being a feral animal, I don't think you're running into those sorts of problems.

[00:42:13] Trevor Gibbs: Well it's not just with, well a couple things, A, it's, it's not just with pigs that they're doing it, um, it's, I mean. Texas is a unique place in that we have a lot of non native animals there. And we're also like, I forget the number, but it's like, it's not a hundred percent private land, but you know, it's out there.

[00:42:37] Trevor Gibbs: Um, and so the way they work is they actually work with different like private ranches. Uh, that allow them to come on and, or, or, uh, either ranches or, uh, can't think today. Um, like state, state park. Yeah. Thank you. State parks and that stuff. So they actually work with them and, and so they're allowed to come on and the landowner will give them like, all right, you can take.

[00:43:09] Trevor Gibbs: X amount of, X amount of these animals, X number of does X number, uh, spikes, X number of, uh, of males, whatever it may be. Okay. And so it's a, it's a pretty, probably you'd somewhat unique scenario down there. 

[00:43:25] Travis Bader: Oh, it sounds properly managed. Yeah, no, it's great. Yeah. So you, you, yeah, it's great. Up, up here we had a, um, one of our local islands has got a, Some invasive deer that they figured they want to, uh, call and rather than putting that out to hunters, who've all volunteered to do it for free and putting meat in the tables or reaching out to first nation groups or whatever it might be, they spend millions of dollars and they get, uh, people from out of country.

[00:43:52] Travis Bader: It's a group from New Zealand and they fly around in helicopters while the other ones on the ground use dogs to drive these things out and shoot them. Sure. It's crazy the amount 

[00:44:01] Trevor Gibbs: of money that's spent. And so that exact scenario was happening on a ranch in South Texas. Um, or not, not a former ranch. It's now was donated and now it's going to be like a state park.

[00:44:14] Travis Bader: Okay. 

[00:44:14] Trevor Gibbs: Well, they had feral hogs. No, had like actual, like, uh, gosh, what was it? It wasn't Neil guy. It was, I can't remember, but you know, big animal, um, not, not elk, not Neil guy. Okay. It was a, God, what was it? It was cer certain kind of deer. But anyways, they, they wanted 'em off because they wanted to make room for more of the, the native whitetail population.

[00:44:43] Travis Bader: Mm. 

[00:44:43] Trevor Gibbs: But the way that they're going about it is that they're a, some of these stewards of the wilds draws, they were allowing people from there to, to come on and hunt. But then they were also giving out during hunting season and draw season. They were, they were giving out draws for, for these animals on this particular.

[00:45:01] Trevor Gibbs: Okay. Uh, area. Okay. And so their plan is over the next three years or so to hopefully have them all off, but they're doing it. And so they're, it's just seems like a way better approach and way cheaper. 

[00:45:17] Travis Bader: Yeah. It's a win win for everyone. They'll 

[00:45:19] Trevor Gibbs: actually make money from, from doing this rather than spending all that.

[00:45:24] Travis Bader: Fancy that. So 

[00:45:26] Trevor Gibbs: weird concept. 

[00:45:27] Travis Bader: When I'm out hunting or in the back country or hiking or whatever, I'm, I'm not in my kitchen, I'm outside. Right. I am drawn to nuts. I'm drawn to meats. I'm drawn to cheeses. Okay. Those are the things that, uh, that I really crave. Uh, sweets. I always figured, uh, you know, I want some sweets when he's, when I'm spending time in the back country, I want hydration, I want salt.

[00:45:54] Travis Bader: Right. Um, and yeah. If I'm not preparing, if we're not making our own stuff to bring on out and I'm going to the gas station and getting the gas station slim gym or something, I'm not feeling good afterwards. Right. Eating something like that. Yeah. What makes yours different than some of those gas station meats that you see?

[00:46:16] Travis Bader: Uh, a few things. 

[00:46:18] Trevor Gibbs: So one is. The quality of the meat is really good. We're, we're solely at this point in time, and I hope forever only sourcing from regenerative ranches in the U S uh, that's a whole, we can go on that side tangent later about, about, about regenerative agriculture. But a big thing is the way we ferment it and also the fat content.

[00:46:47] Trevor Gibbs: Okay. And so we've got 17 grams of fat in the stick and I've formulated it in That way for a reason for exactly what you just said of thinking of the times when I'm most doing the most active things I do and I'm the most tired, whether it's hunting or snowboarding or rock climbing or Surf, like all this stuff I liked, all the activities, you know, me and my buddies like to do.

[00:47:16] Trevor Gibbs: And, and so you want, you want the fat, you want the high calories. And so that's why they're as big as they are. There's over 200, 210 calories per stick, um, 17 grams of fat. And so I, I wanted that satiating part of it. And that came from. The meat and nut diet, which comes from the training world, which is, uh, it's basically the meat and nut breakfast, not the meat and nut diet, but it was, uh, this guy, Charles Poliquin kind of made famous this, this meat and nut breakfast because it was the most satiating for his, for his, uh, athletes and made them the most mentally acute.

[00:47:58] Trevor Gibbs: Um, and so there's just all these benefits to it. And so I was actually making a different product. I was making a meat and nut bar, bison and almond bar. And that's where the name came from. Cause I was going to have like a line of different meat and nut bars. Man bar meat and nut bar. That's where it originally came from.

[00:48:16] Trevor Gibbs: Okay. So you're 

[00:48:16] Travis Bader: not, you're not specifically marketing towards men. 

[00:48:19] Trevor Gibbs: No, gotcha. Obviously it will turn into that, which is, we can chat about that too. Um, But yeah, so, so that's where it originally came from. And so, uh, there were some issues with the nuts on the production side. And so I replaced the nuts with, with beef fat, right?

[00:48:38] Trevor Gibbs: Okay. So that, that's, that's how we got there. And then on the fermentation side, which I think is really the bigger difference is we use a starter culture made from, from beef. Beats the vegetable. 

[00:48:53] Travis Bader: Yeah. 

[00:48:53] Trevor Gibbs: Um, it's kind of like an older old school way of doing it, but you're basically using the sugars and that to ferment the meat that produces a kind of full spectrum of, of the lactic acids that you need for fermentation.

[00:49:08] Trevor Gibbs: And it's just like a, uh, Healthier, cleaner, more expensive approach to doing it. But the difference is, is, is most sticks on the market, just about all of them use, uh, an encapsulated acid, either an encapsulated lactic acid or an encapsulated citric acid. Those are typically an isolated or synthetic version of let's say the lactic acid.

[00:49:36] Trevor Gibbs: And then the hydrogenated part is basically the hydrogenated oil is, uh. It's a way to make the oil a solid at room temperature. And then as the temperature increases, it melts into a liquid. And so you use those because a, they're cheap, B, they're super stable, pretty easy to, to get, you know, if you're making beer, kombucha, every batch is going to be right, a hair different, right.

[00:50:04] Trevor Gibbs: These allow for kind of that variability to, to be greatly reduced the encapsulated acids. Got it. So what happens is you mix these. Mix them up with the meat. You start cooking them. As it's cooking, the hydrogenated oil melts, exposing the acid to the meat, and then the fermentation process can start. Well, that oil doesn't evaporate.

[00:50:26] Trevor Gibbs: It goes into the meat. Right. And so, and that oil is, you know, we're not talking about a, a tallow or a pork lard. We're, we're, Usually talking about some sort of vegetable, you know, something really good for you. Motor oil, essentially . Yeah, exactly. You know, and so that, that goes into the meat and that's, that's why I think so many people have a, the taste of most sticks aren't very, kind of the perspective on, on sticks for me and all my buddies has always been, I want something.

[00:51:02] Trevor Gibbs: I don't want to, I don't want a house, a bag of Doritos or like m and ms, like I want the protein. Mm. Here's a convenient, easy way to get protein. It's never an enjoyable thing. It's never a, let me eat this stick because it's so delicious. So there's that, but those oils and that encapsulated acid I think is, is why you get that rubbery, that's it not food tasting taste, um, excuse me.

[00:51:34] Trevor Gibbs: And so, yeah, so, so that's the encapsulated acid part, which is what most sticks do and why we didn't go with that. It's because I wanted a healthier version. That starter culture allows me to carry a little more moisture. Like, I know you haven't had one yet, but when you bite into it, it's, it's

[00:51:57] Trevor Gibbs: almost more sausage like than the, than the dry, dry stick that you're used to. So it allows me to carry a little more moisture, which in turn allows me to carry more fat. And so that's why we're able to have like, 17 grams of fat in ours, whereas most sticks are nowhere, nowhere close to that. 

[00:52:17] Travis Bader: So I love that a lot of flavor and flat fat, a lot of energy and fat, but there's going to be a large camp of people out there that say fat's bad.

[00:52:27] Travis Bader: Sure. What would you say to that? 

[00:52:29] Trevor Gibbs: Uh, I would say that when

[00:52:37] Trevor Gibbs: I answer this, I would say they're wrong, depending. So depending on where the source of the fat comes from, obviously, that's a big one. You know, animal fats, especially high quality animal fats. They're phenomenal for you. There's a I don't know what else to say aside from that. It's like, they're, they're just, they're not bad for you.

[00:52:57] Trevor Gibbs: Um, you know, for people who don't want to hear that, then the quick answer is they probably won't be a customer. 

[00:53:06] Travis Bader: Fair 

[00:53:06] Trevor Gibbs: enough. But yeah, you know, it's, it's certainly, I understand the people that obviously like the keto crowd, the paleo crowd. The carnivore crowd, all those, all those men and women get it, um, for people outside of that.

[00:53:22] Trevor Gibbs: I think it's just going to be an education thing with, especially as, especially as we grow and are able to talk about that a little more. There's, I think there's opportunities just to show people that high quality animal fats are good for you and you actually want them. They're good for not only physically, but for your brain and the satiating part of food.

[00:53:46] Trevor Gibbs: Uh, Typically comes from fat. Okay. And so like, for example, I, you know, right now I'm probably two Oh five. Uh, what are y'all kilograms here? 

[00:53:57] Travis Bader: I know we do pounds. Okay. We go back and forth. So 

[00:54:00] Trevor Gibbs: I'm too, you know, a little over 200 pounds this morning because I'm traveling. I ate one of these and a small handful of pistachios.

[00:54:08] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. And that was time. Is it 11? That was four or five hours ago. And I'm going strong, totally fine. And so it's. That satiating part counterintuitively allows you to eat less so that you're volume wise, you're eating less, but nutritionally, you're still getting everything you need. And so, and that's where that meat nut breakfast that I talked about earlier, that's another reason he had it because you don't have to gorge yourself or stuff yourself with all this food to get the benefits of it.

[00:54:43] Trevor Gibbs: His athletes could eat. Small handful of meat small handful of nuts and be good to go for a several hour training session Not only physically but more importantly mentally because there's all these in meat in really that protein and fat combo Targets neurotransmitters that are most associated with drive energy and focus.

[00:55:03] Trevor Gibbs: Mm hmm. And so that's why You know, that's, that's the difference between eating meat and nuts or, you know, just high quality proteins and fats where you're feeling a little more energetic, you're feeling mentally clear versus the opposite. You know, let's say the stereotype, go, go eat a big bowl of. You know, big bowl of bread or spaghetti or carbs, whatever, and you know, and then you get that brain drain in the afternoon where you feel like you need a nap so that there's science.

[00:55:34] Trevor Gibbs: There's like reasons for that and science behind it. And so it's that it's just it's targeting neurotransmitters that do a lot of good for you. And so that drive energy and focus pieces. Also relative to just kind of the type of people that we want to market to and that we want to support Just again kind of people were putting their head down doing good word taking pride in their work doing cool stuff going out in the outdoors um building beautiful Things like whatever, whatever it may be.

[00:56:05] Trevor Gibbs: So 

[00:56:05] Travis Bader: I read somewhere that the whole fat idea, the fat is bad idea was something that was perpetuated by the food industry. That was a multi billion dollar, essentially cover up at least for, yeah, at least billion trillion. Right. Um, What was it? Sugar. Sugar is supposed to be the really bad one, but it was fat that was actually really good for you and people should be getting the fat.

[00:56:28] Travis Bader: Um, no, it was cause of the, uh, the oils. It was the, um, uh, those. The canola oil, the vegetable oil, that stuff. Yeah. So they're saying, oh, you got to have these things because this fat, this lard, this butter, it's going to kill you. But you have our homemade oils here. 

[00:56:47] Trevor Gibbs: The foods. Yeah. I mean, the, the food system is, is pretty broken and has been for a while.

[00:56:54] Trevor Gibbs: And even, uh, how do I say it? The, the sources of things matter. So, so do you have those, those mangoes? So this is a really good example. You know, this is my buddy's, uh, mango company, Mangone's. It's a one ingredient product. It's just mangoes. There's plenty of sugar in here, but the sugar is all from the fruit.

[00:57:19] Trevor Gibbs: And so it's, there's no need to add sugar to that. And so even sugar, when we just kind of blanket, make a blanket statement of sugar is bad, which generally I agree with when you're talking about all of these, like ultra processed. Um, you know, like your, your bag of M& Ms, your, the, which I love M& Ms, by the way, not, not, not hating on them, but, um, yeah, it's just very different than eating several of these, which again, also have sugar and also have a purpose.

[00:57:51] Trevor Gibbs: And, but that to me is, especially when you're using it, when you're out doing hard, hard, difficult, interesting things. Most of your problems go away when you're working hard, I feel like, or you're doing hard things. They tend to, because you're in the moment, you're concentrating on what needs to be done.

[00:58:06] Trevor Gibbs: Well, not only that, but even from like a nutritional standpoint, it's like your body will crave, if your body's craving 

[00:58:12] Travis Bader: Yeah. 

[00:58:14] Trevor Gibbs: Eat a bunch of fruit. 

[00:58:15] Travis Bader: Yeah. 

[00:58:15] Trevor Gibbs: You know, and that, and that will go away. It's like you're, it's not that you're, you're bad or your body's bad. It's just, your body's craving this thing.

[00:58:24] Trevor Gibbs: Give it to it. Just choose as good of a source as you can. 

[00:58:27] Travis Bader: Hmm. 

[00:58:28] Trevor Gibbs: And so that's kind of how I'd. 

[00:58:31] Travis Bader: Well, that whole idea of the broken food system, and I agree like thousand percent, I think the, um, butcher paper wrapped with twine, um, packaging speaks to that as well, right? That speaks to the individual who would like to have something a bit more farm to table, something that's, um, That's not fake, right?

[00:58:51] Travis Bader: Something that's been like real food, something that's created well. And there's been plenty of documentaries of like, why are North Americans obese when Europeans, and of course now Europeans are suffering some obesity issues as well. But traditionally they're eating tons, they're drinking tons and they're, they're not putting it on the weight.

[00:59:09] Travis Bader: It's because they're not eating all this highly processed food. Traditionally, they're eating things that are, they're good real food. 

[00:59:17] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. I mean, even they're, you know, You know, the, the gluten in their bread is, is a different, different thing than what we, that, what, what we've got 

[00:59:27] Travis Bader: and 

[00:59:28] Trevor Gibbs: they're also walking, that helps out 10, you know, 10, 20, 000 steps a day, I would guess.

[00:59:35] Travis Bader: Yeah, it does help, 

[00:59:36] Trevor Gibbs: you know, and so it's, it's all of it. It's never, we're, we're, we're complicated beings. Like it's never one thing. 

[00:59:44] Travis Bader: So are you going to be, when you're talking about marketing, are you going to be leaning into the whole man bar, the meat and nut, but the man bar aspect of it? You know, 

[00:59:51] Trevor Gibbs: it, not in the, I, I'm very uninterested in, in.

[00:59:58] Trevor Gibbs: And all the like, man versus woman, male versus female stuff. It's, it's a very uninteresting conversation to me. I think it's an, I get it. I get that. It garners attention. I get that. I mean, I agree that there are differences, but I don't think that it needs to,

[01:00:23] Trevor Gibbs: how do I 

[01:00:23] Travis Bader: say this? 

[01:00:25] Trevor Gibbs: I don't know, I guess I just don't see the point of it. So with man bar with the name, obviously that elicits. It elicits some sort of, it elicits something. Sure. And so I will say that the reason I kept the name, even though I changed the product was because overwhelmingly the response has been extremely positive from both men and women.

[01:00:52] Trevor Gibbs: I would say. I just talked all that crap about knowing all my numbers, but I would say, I would guess probably somewhere

[01:01:05] Trevor Gibbs: 30 ish percent of, of people who have ordered, uh, have been women. Yeah, okay. Um, and so I'm not getting, on a mass scale, I'm not getting like, A lot of negative pushback there. There have been some negative comments, which, which we can touch on in a minute. But to your question, I'm leaning in with the branding and the marketing I'm leaning into, certainly it will resonate with men.

[01:01:36] Trevor Gibbs: I think it will resonate. The hope is that the message, even if women, certain women don't want to eat it, hopefully they resonate with the message and want to buy it, see it as a positive and want to buy it for the men in their lives. Sure. And so. Yeah. It was 

[01:01:53] Travis Bader: a woman who referred 

[01:01:54] Trevor Gibbs: you over here. Absolutely.

[01:01:56] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. Kelsey is a perfect example. Yeah. And so that, that, that's the goal with the branding and marketing. Certainly. Of course, there's probably going to be a higher percentage of male focused marketing. Um, just because that's typically how it works with the people who are hunting, fishing, rock climbing, all that it's not to be exclude, exclude anyone, exclude women, but just by the nature of the numbers and the percentages of who's doing these things.

[01:02:28] Travis Bader: So I was, I was talking to Griff yesterday. He's a, um, ex army ranger and started a company called combat flip flops, right? And so I guess, you know, flip flops, a little, uh, part that, uh, your foot slides into a soul and that part, if you're running around, can rip out at times, right? So their whole slogan is we don't pull out combat flip flops, right?

[01:02:53] Travis Bader: And he, and he just leans into all of this parody stuff and all this. And when Manbar came up, I was like, I wonder if he's going to take this type of approach as Griff. I'd be like, you could have a heyday with what you're doing here. You 

[01:03:03] Trevor Gibbs: certainly can. And you know, I'm, I'm not going to sit here and say.

[01:03:07] Trevor Gibbs: That we're going to have not have fun with it. I don't know what that looks like. And it's certainly not going to be it, you know, it won't, it will be to make people laugh, not, I'll say the people who are drawn to us already, someone's always going to be angry about something. Um, like I said, you know, I've gotten a few, a few negative interactions where, because of the name, but.

[01:03:34] Trevor Gibbs: You know, whatever, like it doesn't, I don't lose sleep at night because of it, because I know, you know, I'm not out here to try and rile anyone up or I'm not, I know that I'm not my favorite people in the world are women, my mom, my sister and my girlfriend, like, you know, it's like, I'm not going to do anything to, to embarrass them or, or, or anything like that.

[01:03:54] Trevor Gibbs: So you're not going to be able to please everybody, but not exactly. 

[01:03:58] Travis Bader: So regenerative farming. 

[01:04:00] Trevor Gibbs: Yes. 

[01:04:00] Travis Bader: Tell me about that. 

[01:04:02] Trevor Gibbs: Educate me. Sure. So, so re regenerative agriculture, uh, is very exciting. And, and this is my way because I don't own land. I don't have a ranch. Uh, not, not yet. You know, hopefully one day I will, but, um, it's a land management principles that, that, that people are using to, That goes way above and beyond organic.

[01:04:28] Trevor Gibbs: And so using, it's basically mimicking nature and it's working with nature is, is kind of the taglines of it. And the way you do that, the examples that are always used or, you know, before fences were up in the U S or really anywhere, animals were just moving freely. And so, you know, we use the example of like all the bison that, that were in North America and them going up and down the plains, but they were constantly moving.

[01:04:59] Trevor Gibbs: But with those, there was always, there were birds that were following them. There were wolves that were following them. There were other animals that were around. And so essentially it comes down to diversity. So how can we mimic nature, put the most amount of diversity. On a plot of land and just kind of let nature do its thing.

[01:05:24] Trevor Gibbs: And so the way they're doing that, obviously that ranches aren't big, people aren't going to take down their fences and most ranches aren't big enough. So back to that checkerboard kind of this funny enough, kind of goes back to the grad school thing. You take that checkerboard, let's say you've got a square ranch.

[01:05:41] Trevor Gibbs: Well, instead of just having one, one big square where you're letting your cattle or your bison or your goat sheep, whatever, just roam around all day. And. So where there's an animal, you know, in theory, an animal in each square all the time, maybe the animals change, you know, but an animal, right? So what this does is it takes all those animals and puts them in one square or, or four squares, you know, whatever makes sense based on the size.

[01:06:12] Trevor Gibbs: So you're putting the whole herd together, basically just stressing the crap out of, out of those, let's call it four squares. 

[01:06:19] Travis Bader: Hmm. 

[01:06:20] Trevor Gibbs: And then moving them off those squares, and going to the next four. 

[01:06:24] Travis Bader: Got it. 

[01:06:25] Trevor Gibbs: And going to the next four, and the next four, and the next four. Got it. And what that does is the same way, I always use the example of like training.

[01:06:33] Trevor Gibbs: We go do a leg day. Today, we hit it hard. We're gonna stress the crap out of our legs. We're gonna be walking funny tomorrow. Maybe in three, four, five days, depending on how hard we get after it, maybe we'll be Like, all right, time for another one. So it's that same idea, but that rest period over these next five days or whatever is where all the good stuff happens is where all we stress the crap out of our legs.

[01:06:57] Trevor Gibbs: Now the repair, the growth, then we come back a little bit stronger. So same idea with the land so that. Stress the land, they're trampling the, trampling the, the, the plants, they're trampling the soil, they're eating part of, part of the grass, they're urinating, they're defecating, they're doing all these things on that land, and then get them off and let, and then let the land rest and repair.

[01:07:23] Trevor Gibbs: Got it. And so it's basically doing that over and over and over and over. And then you can add. What they're seeing with that is they're starting to see more of the natural grasses in that area, depending on where you are. And then as you add more animals to that, like there's plenty of ranchers that are now messing with, uh, what they're calling flirds.

[01:07:43] Trevor Gibbs: A flird? Yeah. Instead of a flock or a herd. You got a flird, got it. Yeah. So they're basically putting animals together. And so it's like, maybe it's your herd of cattle and your flock of sheep. Let's just put them in because. The sheep will eat what the cattle don't. The cattle will eat what the sheep don't.

[01:08:00] Trevor Gibbs: They'll be the end host for each other's parasites. 

[01:08:03] Travis Bader: Mmm. 

[01:08:04] Trevor Gibbs: And now we're getting more birds that come in. So they're eating a lot of the flies with that you take them off. And then some people will be again, each one's different. Um, but then maybe you follow up with birds, like chickens, whatever it may be.

[01:08:22] Trevor Gibbs: Well, now you let them loose on that area. They're going to go find all those, all those droppings, all that manure, they're going to scratch through that, which spreads it out. And so then what really is important, then you're started getting all the dung beetles, all the, all the insects, all of that. So they all come, they're breaking it down, making more topsoil while you're getting all that trampling from the cattle, because you're not taking off every piece of grass on blade of grass on, on that part of the land.

[01:08:54] Trevor Gibbs: So now you have essentially have like a, think of the rain forest. You know, they always talk about like a canopy. Yep. Is that, just reduce that to, to small size. So now you have a canopy of trampled grass covering the soil so that, you know, in Texas when it's getting to 105 every day. Yeah. What would that be?

[01:09:16] Trevor Gibbs: 40. 40 every day. 40 plus every day. Yeah. 

[01:09:19] Travis Bader: That's hot. 

[01:09:19] Trevor Gibbs: Um, you know, now the soil is, if you have bare soil, well that soil may, I mean, gosh, could get up to 130 plus degrees. Mm-Hmm. . But if you've got top soil and you've got that canopy cover. It may be 80. Mm hmm. Stuff can live at that. Sure. And so it's just this really amazing cycle of using nature and, and this is where the, you know, on one hand you can say like humans screw everything up and, you know, all that.

[01:09:52] Trevor Gibbs: But this is where, even though it's like, Cleaning up your own mess where, you know, typically like, again, I don't quote me on the numbers, but I think it takes like 500 years to make like an inch of topsoil just in nature. Well, these guys are doing, these ranchers are doing it where, I mean, they're doing, One or two inches a year through these processes.

[01:10:18] Trevor Gibbs: And so they're able to make new topsoil, which allows for more organic carbon matter, which sequesters carbon, you know, if you want it to, again, however you feel about climate change, it is bringing carbon down in. So now they've got more carbon, they've got more nitrogen, they've got. All these elements that are pro life.

[01:10:41] Trevor Gibbs: And now, again, it's just a cycle that keeps improving on itself. And so it's really cool. I got super into it. Uh, I don't know, six, seven, eight years ago, have always followed it. And, and this is my. Part of my passion, you know, whatever you want to call it, passion, desire was to create this because I'm not, I don't have a ranch and, and I'm not doing those things.

[01:11:06] Trevor Gibbs: So how can I support the people who are doing that, who are doing the right things? And the more products we can get like that, the more people, the more ranchers we can get doing that. It, all that's a cycle too, because they need somewhere to sell it to, so that people can consume it so that more people, more ranchers will be brought in and start practicing those principles.

[01:11:30] Trevor Gibbs: So how are you going to get this into people's hands? Well, in the beginning, right, right now, um, you know, so far I've been bootstrapping it myself, which I can tell you how, how we've done that, which is an interesting way to go about it. But yeah, I mean, it's right now I'm doing strictly direct to consumer.

[01:11:52] Trevor Gibbs: Um, the goal is to, again, support, hopefully align myself with people and companies who. Already have a, an audience, but have a similar mindset and mission. Um, there's a few, I'll tell you off air, a few that I've been talking with just cause, uh, you know, I'm not ready to say that, but, um, yeah, it's just going to events, uh, going to, going to tack events, going to, you know, It's a tactical events, archery events, jujitsu events, uh, just going to places where I think obviously carnivore, uh, keto, any of that stuff and, and just getting out there in front of people and letting them try it because I think, uh, I'm very optimistic with the response so far that once people have it, they're going to see that it's unlike the other sticks they've had.

[01:12:47] Trevor Gibbs: Um, I, I've got a pretty good hit rate once I can get someone to try it. So it's just going to be a matter of numbers. 

[01:12:53] Travis Bader: Well, having a consumable as a product is brilliant. I mean, that's why so many people get into the coffee world and because there's something that people desire and they'll buy more of and over and over again, rather than the one and done, I bought it and I'm done.

[01:13:08] Travis Bader: But having an edible consumable also, I would think would open up a lot of different doors on liability. Um, how do you, how do you navigate that? How do you navigate that whole, because I'm sure the FDA and all these, there's probably a bunch of different, uh, hoops to be jumping through and 

[01:13:30] Trevor Gibbs: yeah, it's, it's a lot of, you know, obviously this isn't my background.

[01:13:34] Trevor Gibbs: And so there's certainly a learning curve, which is part of that two years it's taken to get to here. Um, the, the short answer is basically we've got a, what's called a co packer or, or a, like a manufacturer that we work with that has all of the permits and processes and all that already, already in place.

[01:13:57] Trevor Gibbs: Um, they've been doing this for a while, uh, and then you just have to source from, you know, the places you source from matter and, and they've got to have all of their paperwork and all that as well. So that, that's kind of like a short makes it sound very simple answer is, you know, like, for example, I can't.

[01:14:17] Trevor Gibbs: Like I've got an idea for, for a steak. That's that, that will be a wild pig with pork fat. Um, I can't just go out and like shoot a pig and then take it and, you know, sell it as, as this, uh, 

[01:14:32] Travis Bader: market hunting and all the laws around that. 

[01:14:34] Trevor Gibbs: Right. So, but what I can do in, in at least, you know, down in, in the U S and in Texas, especially as you can trap these wild hogs.

[01:14:45] Trevor Gibbs: And then take them while they're still alive to a USDA processing facility plant. They can kill them and process them in the plant. And then, and then it's okay. 

[01:14:55] Travis Bader: That's not too bad. 

[01:14:58] Trevor Gibbs: No. Um, sure. But as far as like, like whitetail, I won't be able to like venison. I won't be able to do because, because the, the States own them.

[01:15:10] Trevor Gibbs: Um, and that's why a lot of, you know, I, I call these American meat sticks because I'm I'm sourcing from, from us ranches, you know, that puts limitations on us. Most, a lot of places will, will ship from New Zealand. Uh, if they're, if they're trying to do like a grass fed and finish, you know, New Zealand has a really good infrastructure for processing organs.

[01:15:37] Trevor Gibbs: And also if you want venison or elk, uh, stuff that the state doesn't, you know, that the U S doesn't own, um, That's where they get it from. Got it. And again, there's nothing wrong with those meats at all. If they're like, like they're, you know, that certainly there's differences everywhere, but a regeneratively sourced us cow versus a regeneratively sourced New Zealand cow, you know, sure.

[01:16:04] Trevor Gibbs: Whatever. Yeah. My personal thoughts on this is just, I,

[01:16:16] Trevor Gibbs: Wanting to keep dollars in the U S, um, wanting to support American ranchers before ranchers from other, other countries, not saying that they're bad at all, but just, I'd rather source it from the U S than somewhere else and keep the dollars here and support, really support the ranchers and the people on the land who are kind of deserve all the credit that are doing raising, raising animals the right way.

[01:16:46] Trevor Gibbs: It's just that it's like, how do I support the regenerative movement? How do I support the U S again? This is a nothing in the grand scheme of things, but you know, it's still those decisions. And I think that if we can kind of on a higher, higher level, if we can show that we can do it. Maybe that will inspire other people to start making choices, uh, similar and, and, you know, that, that's a good thing.

[01:17:15] Trevor Gibbs: So, 

[01:17:16] Travis Bader: yeah. And so, and you know, just to circle back a little bit, one of the interesting things that I think you're talking about, which is, I think could be brilliant is the, um, a marketing strategy of that first hunt of taking people out and doing, um, you know, Having them connect with nature, whether they're successful in a hunt or not.

[01:17:37] Travis Bader: Right. I mean, if you're going for something that's fairly abundant, that increases, uh, the likelihood, but having your own media company to be able to generate an interest and whether they. Uh, by the product or not, at least that ethos of what you're trying to do is getting communicated. I think that's a really, really smart way to be able to, uh, grow a business out is to, is to look at that ethos, look at what you're trying to do and have other people with, um, both similar mindsets that, that see things in a similar way, as well as opposing mindsets.

[01:18:15] Travis Bader: Yeah. Because maybe you learn something and it's like, you know, I never really looked at it like that and I learned something, or maybe they learned something and they can go back and into their community and just say, you know what, I used to think like this, but now I'm starting to think like over here.

[01:18:28] Travis Bader: I think that's a great way to be able to, uh, to market it. 

[01:18:31] Trevor Gibbs: Thank you. 

[01:18:32] Travis Bader: And it'll be fun, right? It'll 

[01:18:34] Trevor Gibbs: be a lot of fun, man. Cause that, that's, you know, selfishly, I love doing that. You know, it's like, I love being out. I love sitting in a bow stand. I love sitting in a blind. I love walking around looking for animals.

[01:18:46] Trevor Gibbs: And even if you don't, I always tell people the actual like killing of an animal is a very small part of the whole 

[01:18:53] Travis Bader: fraction of a second. 

[01:18:54] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. It's a fraction of a section, but you know, there's so much, you know, Cool stuff about it that I think, and even about guns, you know, especially in the U S we we've got all these mass shootings, it seems like every week.

[01:19:08] Trevor Gibbs: So I certainly get the negativity towards guns. I think it's way more of the pharmaceutical and mental health stuff, but, you know, maybe that's a debate for another day, but I think being able to show, show this stuff in a positive light is there's something to that. And even if people disagree, um, I'm fine if people disagree, you know, they're just like, Oh, I've chosen not to eat meat because whatever.

[01:19:40] Travis Bader: Yeah. 

[01:19:41] Trevor Gibbs: You know, if, if they're cool about it and can have a conversation about it, obviously there will be differences of opinion, all that. But as long as you can have a conversation, all right, cool. It's the people that, that. On both sides that, that, and really with anything where Republican, Democrat, trans, like all this stuff going on today.

[01:20:02] Trevor Gibbs: It's like, if you can't have a conversation and if you can't sit at the table with someone who thinks differently than you, then that's something that probably you need to address rather than blaming them for. 

[01:20:14] Travis Bader: Yeah. There's, and I, people I see are starting to clue into that in a broader sense for a long time, for the last many years now, uh, If you and I have opposing thoughts, generally how our society is structured, it is us against them, you against me.

[01:20:36] Travis Bader: Yeah. You don't like X, Y, Z. Well, I don't like you. Yeah. Right. Well, you're an idiot. Right. Totally. As opposed to, I don't agree with what you're saying, I'm open to hearing it. Guess what? I still don't agree with you. Yeah. But I don't dislike you as a person. Like you're not a bad guy. Right. Just cause we have an opposing thought.

[01:20:55] Travis Bader: And I, you know, people would say that it's, uh, from a political standpoint, it's really good to be able to polarize people so you can, you can set up camps. Um, who was it? Um, uh, man, what his name's escaping me. He's, uh, Uh, lectured on and, um, uh, books on essentially using media to control people, uh, people I've got his book on my bedside table right now.

[01:21:21] Travis Bader: Damn it. It's, uh, anyways, um, it'll come to me. Um, It's a very powerful tool to be able to motivate people in one way or another, what people start to lose sight of is the fact that they are being manipulated. And then all of a sudden they start questioning absolutely everything and maybe things that they shouldn't be questioning, right.

[01:21:43] Travis Bader: That are otherwise self evident and they just, they've lost their sense of standing and bearing as to where things are at. 

[01:21:50] Trevor Gibbs: Well, yeah, sorry to cut you off. Uh, I think those, that team aspect is why we see so much of the, why the extreme seem to be getting more extreme and louder. Mm 

[01:21:59] Travis Bader: hmm 

[01:22:00] Trevor Gibbs: and kind of my bet my kind of thought process in my bed With our marketing for us is that there's a 90 percent of the people that are in the middle, not, not as loud and not as extreme.

[01:22:14] Travis Bader: And 

[01:22:16] Trevor Gibbs: that's kind of how I think most situations probably are just the loudest people have the microphone and make the most noise. 

[01:22:24] Travis Bader: Yeah. Yeah. A lot of people are indifferent, right? Like push comes to shove. They've got ideas on it, but they're not the ones that are out there at the, at the rooftop screaming.

[01:22:33] Travis Bader: Right. Um, the Shootings that you're talking about earlier, which is an interesting thought. When you talk about regenerative farming, when you talk about hunting, when you talk about, uh, uh, sort of a closer connection with your food and with nature, uh, Lieutenant Colonel Dave Grossman. Have you heard of them?

[01:22:53] Travis Bader: Okay. So he's written a few books on killing, on combat, and most recently when he coauthored with a couple of Canadians called on hunting. Okay. And, uh, he's been on the podcast here, but he, like his claim, his initial claim to fame was on killing and it was studied and, uh, looked at and people would use it in the universities and people would pick it apart and other people would get right behind it.

[01:23:18] Travis Bader: But some of his. Um, ideas are that people become disconnected with death and with nature to a point where everything's hidden behind closed doors. You get your food. It comes nicely wrapped up. Yeah. Right. Okay. You go to a, um, A funeral and it's going to be closed coffin. Right. And there's a disassociation and then he combines in like, uh, media and video games and the glorification of violence and further disassociating this concept of, um, Knowing where your food comes from, which I thought was an interesting one that he points out has greater social ramifications on everybody.

[01:24:05] Travis Bader: If they have a more intimate relationship with life and death. Sure. I might have more respect for you as an individual in the same way that I've got more respect for the food that I'm eating on my plate, knowing that this thing had life and it's lived and I'm not going to just waste it. Now, maybe if I'm full, I'll put some way in the fridge.

[01:24:23] Travis Bader: It's not going in the bin. Cause I've got a greater appreciation as where this animal came from, if I hunted it in the same way that, uh, life and death school shootings, mass shootings, all the rest, um, is more humanized is, was part of the argument that, uh, Dave Grossman has put forward. I thought that's an interesting approach.

[01:24:48] Travis Bader: It was just something that you brought up. 

[01:24:51] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. So it's saying that if, if people had more exposure to life and death, in theory, there would be less issues down the road and maybe less shootings. Yeah, I think 

[01:25:06] Travis Bader: that's kind of what he's saying. If, if they have more, a greater appreciation for the value of a life.

[01:25:11] Trevor Gibbs: Sure. I don't disagree with that. I mean, I've told quite a few people that. You know, I, I, I think a way to, again, it's not the only way, but I think a way in a very big bang for the buck would actually be to put guns in kids hands and even if it's a BB gun, not talking about like an AR or anything, but like maybe, maybe, you know, maybe not.

[01:25:37] Trevor Gibbs: So, you know, I, I think if we, I remember reading a something about guy was years ago, but it was talking about like pornography and where it's, you know, in the U S it's kind of, I'm not sure how it is here, but you know, in the U S it's sex is still kind of like a taboo thing, or at least when I was growing up and you know, it's like, it was uncomfortable, you know, it's like, There weren't any topless beaches.

[01:26:03] Trevor Gibbs: So like there was that whole thing and in Europe, it was very different, um, the relationship to it and over there, even though there were, you know, to like use the topless beaches as an example, just that exposure and, and, you know, kid, your mom's doing it probably like it, there just wasn't a weird thing about it.

[01:26:23] Trevor Gibbs: And so, but. Over there, they were having people were losing their virginity later. There was like less cases of, uh, you know, extra marital or extra, uh, outside of the relationship pregnancies, there were people had less partners, all of these things. And, and it was essentially because the exposure of just like, Hey, it's like, nudity is not this big deal.

[01:26:49] Trevor Gibbs: Like chill out. Yeah. You know, but 

[01:26:51] Travis Bader: marketing one on one creates scarcity. Yeah. And 

[01:26:54] Trevor Gibbs: so, you know, but that was very different. Then in the U S where obviously we're hiring all those stuff. And, and I think there's. Even though there are a ton of guns in the U S there's still, I would much rather, I would feel way safer around a bunch of people who have been guns around there, been around guns their whole life than I would without, 

[01:27:21] Travis Bader: you know, I've, you know, I'm sure you've heard the expression and an armed society is a polite society, right?

[01:27:27] Travis Bader: Absolutely. And I've, uh, talked to another guy, he was with NATO and he was like, you haven't been to this place or that place. And I wholeheartedly disagree. And fair enough. He's got his perspective and he's got his reasons behind it, but from the, from the standpoint of exposure, like scarcity creates demand, right?

[01:27:48] Travis Bader: Right. You want, you want something, make it the forbidden fruit. You hide these guns away from the kids. They can't see it. Right. You make everything taboo. And then that's what everybody's going to want it like, what's this interesting thing over here? Um, I, you know, we do, we do training here. We do training with, uh, all ages and we work with local clubs for, uh, and youth organizations and scouting groups.

[01:28:12] Travis Bader: And yeah, I think it was two days ago. We got a, an email. Basically it was, how dare you, you should be ashamed of yourself. Right. And we're like, we're looking at this thing. He's like, how dare you? These are, these are killing instruments. And you're putting them in the hands of a child. And, and, uh, The office responded back and says, well, this is a safety training for individuals who have families that have firearms in the house.

[01:28:38] Travis Bader: And this is government safety training and goes through ABCD and talks about laws and handling and just demystifies the whole process. Like how is that education and that safety training. A negative thing, right? And they come back, no, how dare you? I've been, I've been with you. I've been a member for X amount of time and I can't believe it.

[01:28:57] Travis Bader: Right. Yeah. There's always going to be those types, but I agree with you. Um, having normalizing a process, And having a societal standard around it will, will, I think we'll have a much more positive effect. Look at Switzerland, every household's got guns in it. Yeah. Do you hear about Swiss mass shootings all the time?

[01:29:19] Travis Bader: No. There's a reason why, because it's, it's been normalized. They've been trained, they have rules, they have, uh, things they have to do, but it's, it's not, it's not the forbidden fruit. 

[01:29:32] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. I mean, any time you can be, you know, Educated on something that has those kinds of consequences is good. And anytime you have exposure to things that you're not, yeah, it's like exposure and education are good.

[01:29:50] Trevor Gibbs: They're good things. And so. 

[01:29:52] Travis Bader: It's like, electricity is dangerous. Should we not teach our kids about electricity? 

[01:29:56] Trevor Gibbs: Well, you even using me as an example is that, I mean, up until the last few years, I was terrified of handguns. And why was that? Cause I didn't have any exposure or experience with them. I mean, I remember the first time I got, I went to the gun range, shooting a rifle felt like the most natural thing in the world.

[01:30:18] Trevor Gibbs: I loved it. That same exact. Same exact, uh, day, you know, put the rifle down, go over. My buddy's hands, me, uh, hands me. I think it was like a nine millimeter or something. He was like, shoot this. Now I shot it once and put it down and was like, Ooh, don't like that. And, and, and that's where I left it that first day, but it stuck with me.

[01:30:41] Trevor Gibbs: And then I've essentially reached out to a buddy who's kind of similar to you and just had a ton of training, a ton of experience and all that. And I just told him, I was like, dude, I shot a handgun. It freaked me out. I don't know anything like, teach me. Yeah. I don't like that feeling. Yeah. Yeah. And so I went and I did several lessons with him and we obviously started with safety and it's like, take the magazine out, make sure the clip's empty, you know, here's the safety, all that.

[01:31:14] Trevor Gibbs: And, and you do that and you put enough rounds through it and it was like, okay. I still have a healthy fear of them, which I think you should always have, or a healthy respect, respect, healthy respect for them, but I'm not, I'm not like squeamish about it now. Yeah. And that to me may, if you're doing that with kids and again, it can be a BB gun, it can be.

[01:31:40] Trevor Gibbs: A little BB gun, pistol, like whatever it is, like if they understand the consequences and they, they understand how to be proficient around it, I'm not saying they need to be Jason Bourne or anything like that, but you know, if you can walk up to a gun and know the steps to go through of assume it's loaded, assume the safety's off, how do I make this safe?

[01:32:06] Trevor Gibbs: Great. They don't have to ever shoot a gun. They don't ever have to pull the trigger after that. Mm-Hmm. But like, as long as they know that there's gonna be a comfort level to it and it just seems like a way better

[01:32:22] Trevor Gibbs: bitching about it and doing anything. Nah. So, you know, I hear you. And, and, and all that. So 

[01:32:26] Travis Bader: there's a proactive approach that can be taken 

[01:32:28] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah. And, and should be taken. Yeah. Same reason you people take self-defense classes and do juujitsu. 

[01:32:36] Travis Bader: Same 

[01:32:36] Trevor Gibbs: reason you 

[01:32:37] Travis Bader: wear a seatbelt because you plan to get in car accidents.

[01:32:40] Travis Bader: Yeah, 

[01:32:40] Trevor Gibbs: exactly. 

[01:32:40] Travis Bader: But if it does happen, guess what? I'm prepared. 

[01:32:43] Trevor Gibbs: Yeah, for sure. 

[01:32:44] Travis Bader: Okay. Well, I'm going to put links up in the bio for all of this so people can find it in your social media and your 

[01:32:49] Trevor Gibbs: website. And, uh, yeah, we're, we're small and new. Um, So, you know, any Instagram follows any, any, anything is greatly appreciated.

[01:32:59] Trevor Gibbs: And we'll be coming out with more content soon now that we've got the sticks. And right now you can only buy them on the website, but that's kind of where all the, as we grow, it'll, you'll be able to find stuff on there. I love it. 

[01:33:13] Travis Bader: Trevor, thank you so much for being on this. Yeah, man. 

[01:33:15] Trevor Gibbs: For podcast. Really enjoy the coffee.

[01:33:17] Trevor Gibbs: Thank you. I appreciate it.